What's she gonna do? Brother? When Jeff Townsend media runs wild on you? Molly? Alright, alright, alright, Welcome to another episode of the Bill Duma Experience. I am excited. Bill. We've been relaunching this thing and it's been fun. I haven't talked to you for a few weeks, though. How are you doing. Yeah, I've been you know, life, right, We will touch on it a lot, and we'll talk to people about it all the time, but life catches up to you. Last before the last time we spoke, we had the big annual dinner banquet for the foundation that takes an in credible amount of time and planning, and that's all done in the house. We don't outsource it. Everything's done by the family and the foundation. So we we we skipped a few times of chatting, but we you know, we connected on this thing called the smartphone. But uh, yeah, I'm glad we're back like this, and I appreciate the slight sabbatical, but I'm ready to get back into it. Man. I always protect like I imagine you texting me back, like holding the phone like really far away men like yeah, because it doesn't well, my arms only go so far out sort of like I'm I'm might get tea with my elbows. I'm like t rex mode. But my kids and my wife have one finger the type the novel, and I'm going y E S. And then I learned to use a lot more emojis because it's quicker than I'm really good with pictures. I'm not good with words. You're good with clicking the light. You're like the iPhone. Like, so I like certain these episodes off talking about what you're doing. You were actually on the road a couple of weeks ago too. We headed out to um. We me, me and my my, my truck and uh carry in. We headed up to New Jersey. We were We spoke to New Jersey State Troopers up there, the recruit class. They had one hundred and fifty new recruits. We were we were on campus there with the New Jersey State Troopers. And the funny part about being on the road is, you know nowadays everybody so you know, just fly up, you fly up, and you come back down. Um, but I'm a driver because you know, we caught flights for thirty plus years and we drove from town to town till the end of the tour. So I just treat it as it's not the end of the tour, and and and you know, so I'll drive that that seventeen hours like nobody's business. And so I enjoyed the drive. That's my quiet time. We're all over the place. Um, we're blessed to be talking to people everywhere. So it's just a crazy tie in between. Yah, I want to drive the Philadelphia. You know we talked about I was back up at the ECW Arena. I wanted to drive the Philadelphia. My wife wouldn't have it. So I've actually the Beingo Hall. I'm trying to remember what Jerry Lawler once said about something and toilet paper at the Bengal Hall. Was that, Yeah, something I'll be covered in shit or something. One of those classic Lawler moments. It was, and it was a lot of problems. The guys took offense to it. Oh yeah, and he's actually he could get real heat man gun on a gun on a down a rabbit hole yere. But yeah, yeah, he's got a way with words and he doesn't mince him. And it's you know that those backward compliments and stuff or are he's he's great at it. I mean, you get get into a war words with him. But I remember that place when it was the the little Riky Dink they you know, they when finally had enough common sense to bring a garden. I was in to take a shower or rinse off. I mean, it was just a it was a hole in the wall. And now so I went back, I couldn't believe I was in the same building, in the same same area. Yeah, yeah, but no, I'm glad we did cover what you've been up to because you are doing great things, Bill, and I definitely want to make sure we highlight that basically kick every episode off. So yeah, and I'm with you on the travel right because all of us on the eastern part of the US here you can get anywhere in the country in a day. Yeah, I mean people like seem to like not realize that. It's like driving California. You could get clear up to the border in a day. I mean, it's not awful. It's possible unless twenty four hours to really go just about anywhere on the East coast, I mean the east eastern portion. And as long as you don't get that, you know that white line fever or you know, it's like, oh this is there's certain parts where it's boring. Is all get out, you get some some traffic. But I love to drive like we're we're getting ready, you know, coming up soon, I'm headed out to Missouri. I'll take the scenic rout and stuff like that. But yeah, I think I don't think a lot of people understand that East Coast mentality of up ninety five. You get there, yeah, you could go just about anywhere. So but I mean, I understand the convenience flying, but it's also really expensive sometimes but in gas is high, you know. But I just always have to get I'm always because of work. I travel. I always find myself in that damn Atlanta airport. Oh my gosh. Oh you know how many flights I've missed in that airport, Yeah, to get from one place to the other or delayed, you know, when they let you off the plane and and so I did the math for my wife one time. But you know, okay, I like to be the airport two hours before my flight. Then you got to stand in security. And here in Orlando, you're in security even at five thirty in the morning. You're in line for an hour. So you got that hour. Now you're waiting for your plane. Then there's the boarding, then you have to take the flight, then you have to get your bags, then you got to rint the car and then you And I said, if you add all that up, I'll spend a couple hundred dollars to drive to New Jersey. And it's on my time. I'm relaxed, I listen to my music and no one crowding me, you know what I mean. It always bounces out. Atlanta is a nightmare. It's like the movie Home Alone, like every day, like when there he's in the airport on the second one, right when he gets the wrong city. Yeah, they're like running like that. That's what it's like, and I hate it. It takes you thirty minutes to get across the airport and there's like trains that go sixty miles an hour inside and it's just terrible, terrible. If anything happens your flight beforehand connecting, you're screwed. Yeah yeah, five minutes in either direction and you're not making it, yep, and they ain't letting you on either Right. So we were going to talk some evergreen product today, I guess we'll call it. I wanted to talk to you about Bill Goldberg's career a little bit, because that's something that, oddly enough, that you actually associated with quite a bit, because as Goldberg premiered, it was actually against humor. As yourself, you get taught if people talk to you about Goldberg quite a bit throughout the years. But you know, it's funny. I think that's the probably that's the number one thing when people realize who who I am or who I was? You're the Goldberg guy. And my answer is, yeah, you're Goldberg beat you first, you were the first. Yeah, I kid are out with a lot of the younger kids who now are on you know, what is a peacock or whatever it is. We can go and watch the network. And I said, but how did I do? Like? What are you thinking about the stuff I did that? No, you're all Goldberg. He went through you first, and I wanted to say, listen, he had no name till the end of the match. Yep. But I remember it like it was yesterday. I've I've said this for the past twenty plus years since Bill debut or whatever it's been. He's a class act. He was always good to me. I enjoyed it. And there's a bunch of there's not a bunch. I know there's two or three different versions of how I handled being told that, and we can talk about that. But I enjoyed it. I enjoyed Bill. Every time we see each other as a big embrace and we get to catch up. Nobody knew, And I think that's the common denominator across any story you hear about Bill is no one knew what was going to happen. It was he was just a big, impressive guy caught lightning in a bottle. Yeah, let's see what we can do with him. I was fortunate enough to be the one in the ring when it happened. And I think a lot of it because they literally used his name, if I remember the story right. They weren't gonna name him, you know, they weren't going to say who he was. It was gonna be a who is this guy? Where'd he come from? For weeks? What they said his name at the end of the match and they said, well, you know, screw it, we'll just go with Billberg. I think he's a fantastic guy. Fantastic Yeah, we'll kind of start out from the beginning. Obviously, Bill Goldberg big into football, right star at University of Georgia, he found his way into the NFL. I guess what I'm asked it. Did you when he got to the power plant? Did you know about him then? And what were How does that line up with what you were doing? No? I had no, I had no. And there's another we could We could go on about how everybody connects me with the power plant, because when I took over the training early on, years and years, I never had anything to do with the power plant. I think I was in the power plant once on a day off in between shows, so I went to I went for a workout, but I knew there was a bunch of guys in there. I knew he was Dallas's buddy because I think Bill had come around maybe once or twice at a TV taping. But he didn't come around like he was one of the boys. He was a guest. But I really didn't know anything about him. I didn't know anything about never met Bill, never talked to him before that night, So I didn't. You know, there was no buzz about you can't wait to see this guy. It wasn't like he was Paul White, you know this this young giant. Yeah, where you you know, you had to find out and you heard the buzz about him. There was really no buzz to the general locker room, you know. I'm sure there were guys like Dallas and and Eric and guys who had their ideas about what they wanted to do with them and what they saw in them, but I wasn't privy to any of that. So the first my first encounter with Bill was that night in Salt Lake, you know. And I can't speak for Bill because obviously I don't know, but I've always heard that he connected also with Lex Luger and Steing lifting weights. At some point in time he come across and they said, hey, he should be a professional wrestler because he had some injury issues right with football. Yeah, they played for the Falcons and plagued with injuries. So we talked about the power plant here, But were there I don't know how many people they typically have in there at once, but I'm sure there were other athletes in there as well. Maybe maybe not to that caliber, but I'm sure that was part of the recruiting process, right, So I know they did like documentaries and stuff when they filmed the trading in the power plant, and there was a ton of ton of cats back then are super athletic, and they all came in excuse me about at the same time. I mean, you got guys like Palumbo and o Aaron, Jin Drack and and all those young cats in there too. So I mean even Chabo Guerrero came through the power plant before he started, So I know there was a bunch of bodies and athletes from all different you know, walks of life. And at the time, I think Sting and Lex had the gym there in Atlanta, so I'm sure that's where they ran into him, and and you know, that's where a lot of the boys trained on their off days or when they came into town for the tapings if they didn't live in Atlanta. So yeah, it's famous with that area. Yeah, yeah, I'm sure it quickly. You know, people knew about him. I was just one of you know, just one of the guys in the locker room. I wasn't part of that scene. You know, I didn't live in Atlanta. I didn't you know, hang out there or anything like that, so most of the time I was just in and out. He made a handful of appearances on dark matches. I've read that he faced Buddy Landelle to leave And were you were you actually in a dark match with him beforehand? No, I don't, I never. I had never come in contact with Bill until that night. It was in Salt Lake, right, I think of Salt Lake. Utah, Um, I believe it was Salt Lake ninety seven, September twenty second. Geez a loop. I don't even know how you know that stuff, um, But yeah, yeah, that No, we didn't. We didn't hook up in a live events or a dark match or a house shows or anything like that. That was the literally the first time we met was the first time we were in the ring together. When do you remember actually hearing about him for the first time? And what was the general consistus in the locker room? Did you hear anybody shattering about him or nope? Nope, nope. I I remember Terry Taylor, who was who was the agent, came up and and and delivered the news. And only the way Terry Taylor can listen. You gotta, you know, put this guy over and has done you can do about it. It's gonna be quick, and you know they're gonna take a look at him and he's the next big thing, you know, just do your job, which is terrible impression of Terry Taylor, But yeah, Terry, Terry made it seem like, well, listen, you know you've been doing good, but this guy's the next big thing and you're a piece of meat tonight. That wasn't a vibe from Bill. That wasn't the vibe from Kevin Sullivan. I actually appreciated when Kevin shared his thought process on who you know, who would they put with Bill for his debut match. So I considered it a badge of honor um and and dealing with Bill before, during, and after awesome. Yeah, because if you think about it that night when you faced him, if things would have went differently, there might not be Goldberg at the same level. We don't know that for sure. Yeah, but hell so you took it to heart personally that you were gonna make sure this gather pushing look good. This is where in my career I got I got told a bunch of times by a lot of veterans and people like I never they you know, people claim I never took care of myself, I didn't stand up for myself or anything like that. I got into this business on a whim. You know, And so my whole career was made on like I was a bumper. That was my thing. I was a big guy who could move good, but I was a bumper. And whether I had a streak of winds or but my character was getting over and you know, I started, I was starting to make some headway in the company, but I never looked at it as well, why should I have to put this guy over? Now? See that's we'll go back to what I said. There's different stories out there. Terry Taylor went and said, we'll build them up, made a big stink and pride about it. And that's not that's not that's that's the furthest from the truth. Because I think Bill put it in his book or something that I was unhappy about doing doing the favor, but that's farthest from the truth. My answer was, Okay, I know my job is and you go through my career. On any given night, I'm putting over somebody, and it just so I ended up putting over the best in the business. We're going with Savage and Hogan and Sting and Flair and Anderson and up and down the line. There was no ego with who's going over it's just how can I do it in the right fashion? You know, looking back on it for years, I could have been a complete knucklehead about it and said, well, I'm not hitting him with my finish so he can kick out, Like I don't know what a lot of like let's go behind the curtain a little bit. There's a lot of things where people won't do their signature stuff to help someone out. I never looked at it like that, like, what's the biggest reaction he was gonna get that night was going to be after the moonsault, because until that point there was one or two people that may have kicked out of it, one being whole Covid. I can't name the second person at that time who it was. It might have been Bill might have been the only second person to do it. But and you see, if you go back and watch that match, and I encourage everyone to go back and watch it, because I had a lot of fun in it. It was it was, it was physical, it was it was a I thought it was a good little piece of business. But I hit him with my finish and when he kicked out, you look at that that sold out arena and they couldn't believe that someone kicked out like that's what I was known for. So Bill kicked out and then he jack hammered me and all at one, two three, And you heard it in the commentators. You saw the crowd, you saw my face, and you saw Bill's demeanor, and that's what made Bill. I didn't make Bill. It was Bill's demeanor how it went. But you're right, if you know, as veterans say, if I would if I would have slipped on a banana peel, or if I would have accidentally poked him in the eye, or I would have been clumsy and made him look clumsy, we might we might not be having this conversation. But that wasn't the case. Man. It was just you. Your job was to, you know, wrestle, no matter whether you're going over or not. And when Kevin says, hey, there's something to this guy, we want to see what he's got, that's all I need to hear. Yeah, I definitely we're gonna talk more about Kevin one day, for sure. But I do have a question about Terry. When I often hear a lot about Terry's story wise, it's often said that there's some miscommunication with what actually happened in a situation to what he communicates to other individuals. I'm not I'm not trying to shiittle over the guy, but I've heard this a handful of times throughout the years, and it seems to be a thing where he might miscontrue information when he's communicating back or when he leaves the area, which doesn't seem like a managerial thing. That's right to do it. It's if you get to know him. And I got to work. I got to work with him, and then you know, fast forward years later when I took over the developmental system, he was one of my coaches. M I know he didn't care for that. He doesn't like to be I think he always wanted that certain respect and I think he got to deliver things. And and let's face it, he's been known to talk to people differently, right, So that's just the way he is. He's very condescending at times. He can be very crass, and he can make you feel definitely less than he's smarter than you, and this, and you know all these things and and and it's not just a bagging on Terry, but that's just his his delivery in his communication style. So he you know, he gets to tell his story his way, so you know it's it's naturally go yep. I had to make this happen because you know, Humors had a bad attitude and he wasn't going to do it. I had to just put him in his place. So that's that's not the case. But he's he's known to be very uh as we all are, as we all can be, we all can be challenging when we communicate, but he has he has that reputation of seeing things inappropriately or or spinning a different, you know, a different side to the story. That's my experience. Yeah, no, I got you. It's almost like I wanted to be proven as a manager, right, like uh by saying that, but also not realizing that the walls are pretty thin per se in any workplace and that and that goes two ways, right. It may may have helped him feel better I'm a manager. I yeah handled the situation, look at me, but but it also has an impact on those Did you have to explain this to Goldberg? Was there a conversation? No? Did what was everybody like? How how much was that being said? This misconception that you were a painting the ass over this. No, I don't think it was. I don't think it was said to anyone else and everybody who knew me Bill, I don't want to be I don't want to be wrong when I said. I know it came out later, whether it was Terry who shared that story or it was in Bill's book that Terry told him. You know what I mean, I don't know for beat him. So I don't want to be you know, I don't want to trap myself in a corner. It was never said to me, it was never spoken about amongst the boys. I mean, we did good business, and I think Bill was told something and he goes with what he was told. But as far as Bill and I went, I mean, and I always kid around about this part, like I was number one, and then I was number seven, and then I was number thirty two, and then I was like, you got to I got to dance with Bill quite a lot in the streak, and Bill was freaking when we did stuff. Bill, Bill, Hey, what do you want to do? I mean, I remember one night I was dropping the elbow to the floor from the ring and Bill was staying there taking it. I mean, I enjoyed working with Bill I mean, but one the only one thing that I would ever say is a I feel like I he took a shot at me. Was I think he was talking to stone cold years just a couple of years ago. He said here, it didn't help me. I really had to get him up. He was heavy. Go back and look at that thing, because yeah, go back and look at that. I've never deadweighted anybody or anything like that. So that's the one thing I always want to say, where did that come from? But that's if that's how we felt, that's fine. But I prided myself on never I did it to one one superstar one time, and it was a big to do and I'm sure we can talk about that some other time. But um, yeah, I never heard anything about it. I was. I was flattered what I became part of Bill's first book. I think the chapter was Hugh's Next instead of Who's Next? And like I said, I see Bill every now and again. I've watched his career. I've watched what he can do, and I've watched what he's done. And you know, people can say whatever they want, but until you're in the ring with the man, or until you until you've dance to them and dealt with him. I can't comment on I know he's a great family man. I can't comment on who he hangs out with. I can't comment on what he does in his spirit time. All I can comment is on my relationship with him in the ring and outside the ring. He was always respectful. I was always respectful. I think I happen to think he's a he's a hell of a guy. And back to the long winded answer of the initial thing of what was it like? I consider it an honor of like if I have a place in wrestling history, and that's it. Yeah, that's pretty that's pretty freaking cool. It's certainly not a bad thing. I mean, it's a it's not a real fight, it's not a I mean, this is a that's the business. And you were a part of that moment. Yeah, a big moment, mad as well, so I do. So you and Bill were fine after that. Who did Bill get go to for advice and stuff like that? We always hear different things like Kevin Nash throughout the years. Did you often see him hanging out with anybody? That is your experiences with him at the time in wc W. Everybody was kind of hanging out all over the place. I mean, I mean, even even if you had a separate locker room area and a couple of guys were in that one or a couple of guys were in this one. You saw Bill where you saw him. I know he's tight with Dallas. I know as things progressed, I know he was tight with Kevin. I'm sure like without having an absolute in person knowledge of it, I know that Bill picked a lot of people's brains. Jody Hamilton early on. I mean, it's just he was. I feel like he was a student of the game and trying to learn from everybody. I think, what what perception is it? Because he had such a rocket on him, people thought he was in business for himself. But at the end of the day, we as a company created that for Sona. So how can you Why would you bash what you created? So there was a lot of animosity there, as there always is in any industry, but in wrestling it's egos and money. Well why is this guy getting such a rub now? And why is he flying first class? And why is he getting great hotels? And why is he you know, flying separately? And you know all these things. I didn't surround myself with that crap. That's a bunch of crap. And if I just making him a lot of money, hey, he was making a ton of money, and good for him because they But the other side is they ran him like a dog too, appearance wise and everything else. A great movies and all these things. But when you add it all up, that's all time away from personal. But I thought he carried the torch well. I thought. I thought he did really well with it, you know, as he as he was gone after the sale of wc W and then he came back. I think it was hot for a while, and then I think it you know, it played its course up there because it's a different type of ball game up there. Um. But listen, you can't take away from me as a Hall of Famer. I haven't heard anybody come out and say anything directly how bad of a person he is as a man, as a wrestler. People have opinions, they share of what they think's right or rum good or bad, and that's just opinions. There's nothing you'll You'll never hear me say anything derogatory or bad about it. Basically didn't you'd be far reaching to hear me say anything bad about anybody. But I had a bad I had a great relationship with Bill. Like I said, I I wouldn't see Bill for five years, and I'll be in a the parents where Bill is and I'll go to say hello. Bill stops his whole line. Bill stops the line of autograph seekers at all picture thinkers, and we sit and talk for a couple of minutes. I've seen Bill spend time with kids and spend time with certain fans, you know, and and special needs. He's he's his arts as big as he is, and he turned his brand into something special. So good good on him. And if I could be a part of that, I'm gonna brag about that all the time. Yeah, we're kind of walking through the timeline here. The first time that you really started to read and let's let's say the dirt sheets your favorite about Bill being a little bit paranoid. And there was a situation that happened with mister Regal in a match. Oh you know, so take me back to that moment from what you remember backstage when so basically, if those lessening, he don't know, he as he got into the streak a little bit. He had a match with Steve at William Regal whatever you want to called mister Eagle, and he kind of it showed that he didn't have a whole lot of experience. He was pretty green. And there's a lot of different stories about Eric Bischoff being extremely upset, Ye Bill being extremely upset, mister Regal saying, hey, that's what I was told to do by this unnamed agent. What do you remember from the tension? And like that situation on your end, I don't have a good analogy, but you look at where Bill was going, and he was red hot, and he had all these matches, and so how do you keep him hot? You don't give him local talent. You give him the guys that have names in the company, right and Regal. Regal has a certain style and a certain demeanor. But at the time Regal just wasn't gonna lay down and just you know, making a bump fest. So again, I can't speak on it. I can only see the perception was Regal. I'm trying to think of the right way to say without rubbing everybody the wrong way. See, the Regal is one of the best wrestlers ever. I think he's very underrated. His skill set is through the roof. Yeah, he bill Over having an eight minute match with him, and it wasn't the same skill set. And Regal wasn't gonna, you know, if you look at it, Regal wasn't gonna lack of a better term, dumb is stuff down to get through the eight minutes and people going, wait a minute, We've invested this guy, and now you're showing him up. And I think that's where it all came from. So the unnamed the agent and all these things, and you're doing what you were told and all these things. Listen, you have two options. When you go out there, things go the right way and sometimes things don't, or there's a definite path being taken. And so a lot of people would say, and I think, and I'm not talking about fans, because you know, fans have their own opinion. I'm talking about the boys. A lot of the boys good for you, Regal and all this other stuff, and at the same time bad for business. And so then I think that's when bills, you know, rightfully, so anybody who put their guard up after that and think that now they're gonna get bamboozled or shown up. And when you're when you're trying your best and doing what you know, and someone's out shining you and then gonna slip on a banana peal. You're not really going to get over that way too many more times, you know, So I think that was the whole thing was there was, you know, somebody who's putting a stick in the spikes and trying to stop the train. So fast forward a little bit to early nineteen ninety eight. He's beating people like Brad Armstrong. He had a he pinned Perry Saturn, I believe, and they stopped referring to him as Bill Goldberg and just went with Goldberg. And also around this time, they started mentioning the streak. It's like as whenever Saturn was like the seventy fifth or something, seventy fourth maybe, and they started referring to the streak. Do you remember the streak being mentioned? Yeah, well everything was the streak, And the funny part is, and I still like, you remember a lot more about the nineties than I do, because he went from seventy four and the next victory he was an eighty two and then the people did. But the people didn't see like I guess maybe they should have explained some live events counted or whatever the case, because even Bill wasn't doing that many live events. But like every time you're on TV, this streak jumped ten times. And so that's why I kid arons. I was one, seven thirty two. You know, you had to have and and I have the guys that we're gonna that we're gonna do business for him and with him too, you know, until he was ready to match it up with Nash and all those you know, all those guys on top. Um. But yeah, the street came out of nowhere, like it didn't start at one. I was first, So I was one. I think we'd have to go through some kind of wrestling and cycle Beeda to find one through seventy four and to see how many times each guy was part of the streak, you know what I mean. But uh, once the streak started, I knew that was a big thing. Um, once they started counting, and it's not. And again it's not like we were all told the back, hey, we're gonna do this streak. People weren't involved in the creative. Unless you were involved in the creative, unless it taint you. You didn't know crap about what everybody else was doing. And that was the thing about w c W. The time you were in the know or you weren't in the know, and if you weren't in the know, you were screwed from jumpstry fair point. And it's also important to say it's a work and it didn't absolutely matter at all what the people the crowd didn't care about, the like at the Shames Hill or not. To them, it was everything. They didn't care. He could have came into at the time. He could have came into WWE and his first victory could have been three hundred and twelve. The people wouldn't have cared because they know between the time he was gone and they saw him that he had another one hundred and fifty victories. You know, you could have kept it going. It's it gave people something to grab onto and it gave Sometimes it gave a very dry match or a not important match, it gave something to talk about and then the victory meant that much more. It wasn't about who he beat, It is the fact that he kept beating people. Yeah. Next in line, Bill starts getting opportunity at the at some championships. Right the United States Heavyweight one being the first one. He defeats Raven to capture that, and they have a little bit of a feud with the flock, and I believe that's when um he beats like Conan and then Kurt Henning. Then the catchphrase Who's Next comes in which has got over like crazy. But going back to Raven, did you work with Raven quite a bit? Yeah, I've known. I've known Scotty for years and Independence and h ECW and all those things before before we ever got back together in WCW. I've known Scotty forever. Well. Later on we get this thing known as the nWo. You may have heard of it. But as far as Gilberg's Gilbert Goldberg, He's gonna beat my ass now, Freudian slip, forty slip, Freudian slip. No. But as far as like his first feud with a faction, it was with Raven in the Gang. And I think Raven also played a pretty big part on Goldberg coming out as the badass too on that he probably doesn't get much credit at all, but that was a pretty decent little feud he had there with the fuck Yeah, And I think that was the natural build up is individual opponents. Now he's going to take on a gang, you know, and and so that that I think it all worked. Now you look back at it and it's freaking genius. When it was happening, you know a lot of the guys well why is this happening? Why are they doing there? But look back on the history of w c W, and it's it was genius. And yeah, the Raven and the Flop played a big part in it, staying in Luger playing a big part in at Nash and and the Hull played a big part. I mean, I dare say, not comparing myself, I was just as big a part of Goldberg's thing as Hulk was, or as Raven or as you know, anybody he feuded with. I mean, he feuded with the starters he funded, you know. And I think what made him bigger and batter was it wasn't just one person. He was taking on the masses people. People relate to that people. That's that's interesting. How many people are gonna do it? Well, you can beat one starter, but you can't beat them both. This is around the time when you're getting these people that you're mentioning. This is a great example. If he gets into the position where he is on the edge there he's a main adventor. Now yep, he's becoming a contender for the world the World Heavyweight Championship, right, which is held by Hollywood Hall Cogan. So they do that. That's obviously his first feud, right, he gets the nWo, you get Haul Cogan, and he has the match in the Georgia Dome in Atlanta in front of forty thousand plus people, obviously to capture it. You always hear people give a lot of crap on the fact that they did the match then and not on a pay per view. Yeah, and the build up is people know Bill from Atlanta, from from from playing in Georgia, from playing with the Falcons, and from being in that area. I mean that that's always the thing is your play. I know Vince's thing was your You know, we were in front of twenty thousand, but you're playing to twenty million. But I don't think that was the mindset there. Where were you going to get The biggest response is you know, in Atlanta at that one, which led to I don't think they were really concerned about the pay per view part. I think it was the fact that you're in Atlanta and you're gonna blow the doors off the you know, the roof off the Georgia Doe. Yeah, it makes sense. At that time, we had a different booker, we had a different boss every six months, and there was no way to follow who was thinking, what and what everybody was doing. All I know is it was it was fantastic business. And that night in the Georgia Dome I quit. I think I think it was that night I wrestled Glacier, I think, and my time get back and look at this. Yeah, okay, I think. Am I on the card with Glacier. I'm gonna look here if I could find it. I think that was the night. So I was in my own private idaho, I uh and I and listen. I went over and everything Glacier was Gray. I love Ray. I talked to Ray, you know quite often. Um. And it had nothing to do with the rest of It had to do with how I, you know, being perceived backstage and and and what they were doing with me, and what was promised and what was done and my contract was up and I was I was, I was taking a stand, And I believe that was the night. Jimmy Hart was talking to me, trying to talk me out of it, and I got a victory, uh, in the Georgia Dome, and that's it. I took my I took my stuff and went home. Naturally, I came back, but that that night, I remember that night. Um. I mean, it's how do you go wrong? And that's the thing. People go, well, you should have done the pay per view, you should have done this. Well, you just had this amazing house and you proved that you didn't need a pay per view to draw that house. You know, you when you fill a Georgia Dome and you do that kind of business. I think they just proved they can do it anywhere they want. And I think that was the mindset was we're gonna do it this way. We're not gonna go with the form or you know, the formula has been laid out for us for years. That that's just my opinion. I couldn't give a definitive its or why they didn't wait for a pay per view. No, I was gonna say, it's always funny because would you talk about this situation with you it's not really documented as you quitting, and it's just like Bill was away for a little while doing the family thing. It's not like like like, yeah, your your active roster, remember everywhere you go and look. But it's interesting that you're recalling the events here as I quit. You can't certainly find that on very many places that that happened. So that's I always think that's interesting. It wasn't public knowledge like and because I wasn't, And that was half the point. I wasn't considered a wheel, you know, a cog in the wheel or anything. It's just one of those things. And I think I was home for about two weeks before you know, eventually got brought back to Atlanta and talked to and things were restructured and I went back to work is and you know, nobody's business like nobody knew except Sullivan because he was going to live events. I wasn't there. Where are you? I'm home. I've told you I'm done. But yeah, but what I was saying earlier about you know why we didn't do in a pay per view, I think we did if you look back at it, and you know, people research it. I think we did a lot more on TV, and we did better business on TV than we did on paper. Yeah, and you got and WCW is really trying to continue to climb the ladder in the television scene, so makes sense. Yeah, the Who's Next? Phrase, however, was that until until you said it didn't start at a certain time because it was so over, I would have said and started that night in Salt Lake City. I have no recollection of him never saying it, that's how over it was. And my memory, which is rotten anyway, but I would have thought that night was Who's Next because once they started that, Yeah, that was the biggest thing in wrestling, that was the biggest thing in sports. You know him, And then the only thing that was that was more over than Who's Next was him inhaling a bunch of charcoal and then blowing it out of his nose on the entrance. I mean everything he did became gold. Interesting to watch that entrance develop over time too. Yeah, it took a little while, but it was fine tunes throughout the way. And then I'm not sure any other people that could pull off of the entrance, so damn long. No, it's been tried just recently. Yeah, well Moxley still does it. Yeah, and they tried to do it with Ward Low and and some other guys. But you're you got Big Bill banging his head open on lockers and knocked it on the door, and security walking him through. And then after all that longevity of an entrance, he stands in that smoke inhales. You know how if he does that black glung when he's ninety years old, no one will. But everything he did was gold And I think, and again I'm always going to propose this without me knowing the inside story. It was a well calculated plan by Bill. I want to do this, this is what I see, This is my vision, and they let him run with it. What was what people say was lacking in the ring? It was all made up in the pop and circumstance and the getting over the guy was the guy was huge. I mean, he's part of pop culture now for crying out loud. So who's next? I thought, who's next? When it started that night, I didn't I have no recollection that there being such a times man before that became the catchphrase, because everybody had a shirt, everybody had the dolls, there were tattoos being made. How many guys I saw in locker rooms after that with the Goldberg tattoo, legitimately getting the same Goldberg tattoo. When I first met Randy or Randy at the Goldberg tattoo, that was the only thing it was on his arm, and I'm thinking to myself, you gotta be kidding me. Bill Goldberg was absolutely huge, and I remember that night because he had to overcome all the hull Coogan was stacking the deck against Him's what I'm trying to say with Scott Hall. And that was a lot of television time for Bill in a wrestling sense. Yeah, like that night was huge for him. Obviously, he comes out end of the night, he wins the title, huge moment. But he put in a lot of work that night, and I think as a testament of the work he had put in the months before to be in a position to be able to do that. So Bill never shied away from anything Bill. A lot of people think that they just gave it to Bill and he just showed up, did his thing and left. Bill put in the time. I wasn't with him at the power Plant, but Dallas was, and you can hear Dallas tell the stories like Bill from my recollection Bill watch tape, Bill ask questions. It wasn't just Bill going, Hey, what's every we're gonna do for me. He he was putting ten pounds of crap in a five pound bag. He was trying to figure it all out faster than anybody else had to figure it out. And then I think it just came to a point where he goes, hey, I have an idea of who I am now and what I want to do, and then and then run with it. He was a workhorse. He didn't just show up for five minutes a night. He was a workhorse. He had the two belts for a short while, and I thought it was interesting that he had to vacate the title, the US title. That's a Who's interesting to me that you couldn't have to like like, I couldn't he just carry two belts until he figured out? But then again like who could you have beat him to take it off of him? That's exactly it. That's exactly what. Well, who were you gonna who were you going to invest that time in to build up to do that? So it's either vacate by punishment or keep by defeat, And so storyline wise, it's you know, it is what it is, because then you would add to put the same amount of steam on someone else. And and also at the time, how many people want to be US Champion instead of world champion. So I'm not sure there were that many big, big names knocking on the door to go let me be the guy who defeats them for the US champions You know what I mean. It's it was a lesser than picture. How does that go up against the television title? Do you think? What's that? Sorry you're kind of cutting in and out. If it sounds like I'm cutting you off, I'm really not. But I said, how big that title? US title? How does that compare to the television title? In your eyes? And in a different era, I think it it compares. I think it's a step above. But I like I like the old world class and all those things. And look at the NWA. If you were a US Champion, you were the man. But then they decided that, well, the TV Championship was just gonna be for you know, a kid that we're going to try to get over and we don't have to put that much steam, and let's see what he can do with this championship. And I felt like it was TV Championship, US Championship and then forward, forward, forward, So I think as time went on, people treated and by people, I mean people backstage and the control and um, the workers. Why would I go for US Championship when I can be this. I'd rather be a tag team champion. I'd rather be this. And then the TV title was non existing, and then you try to bring these things back, and people stopped caring about them because we stopped caring about that network obviously there aw today is has a title that's connected to television, so it seems to be a common theme. I liked it. I listen, I was I was a US champion. I was. I was happy to be that. I thought it was. Harley Race was a US champion, Flair was a US chair, Steamboat was US Jim Dust, everybody who was worth their their weight in gold in his business was the US champion at one point. So, but I think as it pertained to Bill to your point, who were they going to get to beat him? So it's just okay, let's let's manipulate things and you can't have to and all this other God God that came with it, Gaga. I love that we went on to the next He gotta work with Diamond Dallas Page, like you said, so I'm sure that was a pretty cool moment for him. Obviously he got a lot of that in before he loses Undefeated Shriek Stops. But I'm sure it was cool for him to get to work with Diamond Dallas Page for a while. Yeah, I'd imagine. I know they have a good relation. I know they add a good relationship. I believe they still have a solid relationship. And I think, you know, for Bill to work actually be in the ring and work with Dallas after all the like, Dallas was his mentor for a long time, and Dallas was really one who helped him get into the business and and all these things, and and uh, it's safe to say that if you were under Dallas's wing, you were okay because Dallas really did want people to succeed and he had a Dallas had a vision for everybody. I'd imagine it was quite an honor to work with to work with him during that time. Yeah. I think he's on record saying that match Halloween Havoc was his favorite. So yeah, yeah, no doubt. Uh So, wow, let's go to the big moment in time here when Bill Goldberg loses his title to Kevin Nashley, undefeated street ins. Yeah, one hundred and seventy five days in the record was noted that his win loss was at one hundred seventy three. Oh one hundred seventy three. A couple of weeks ago on this anniversary, I shared as on social media this moment with the cal Pottle all of that. It just seems so like it. But I'm an armchair quarterback, right, I'm not near anything like you guys. But it was just such a shame for me back then to see it end like that. I heard people, whether it was on a documentary, I heard everybody talking about it. I heard Hall talk about it, Nas talk about it, Bill talk about it. And I think watching it at the time, the cattle prod. So I think at the time, if you can talk people into the story and make them believe it's gonna work and this is why it ties up, you know, more power to you. But you know, looking back at it now, and I think we're when I say we, me, you, the fans, the wrestlers that were involved, we're all smarter than we were then, and we look at it differently. You go, really, that's that's what we went with. And I think a lot of people were disappointed, and I think a lot of people are still still scratching their head over that decision. But I don't know if creatively they just ran about out of ideas of what do you do to a dinosaur? Right? You can't just you can't shoot him. You gotta do something. So what gets him? Let's bring in a cattle proud and if I'm not mistaken, and don't owe me this, did I hear him say that? They actually he actually like he zapped him, like he made don't know, it's certainly sound and look like it. I don't know. I'm trying to remember the story. I think I think Scott said, he goes, well, if you're gonna do it, you might as well do it, and he lit him up. He sold it, I'll tell you that much, the best selling moment he had had thus far. And he freaking man, he would yeah, but no, I will say this, Bill, And I was watching the Royal Rumble last weekend Full Disclosure. That's the tour recording this and it's always fascinating to me. And I'll tie you this back into that. How many storylines are going on in the same match, how many things are relevant? Going on in the same match. Yeah, and I think for me going back to this match, it kind of had this awkward storyline with Kevin Nash as well because he didn't know what happened. That was the thought behind it on the story, So I mean, you did have more than one story going on there in the defense of that decision. Yeah, And I think that could be like playing that armchair quarterback or booker. I think they probably we were already booking other things and thought it would make sense to everybody else. But there's there's always so much. At times, there's really good underlying stories that can take part and brange off, and at times I just think it's overthought and everybody will get it. If they don't get it, we'll explain it to them later, you know that kind of thing. And by everybody, I mean the fans and things like that, because listen, there was clearly things in the back that we all didn't understand. But how well, how do we get in a streak let's cattle problem, how do we beat them, how do we do how do we take the tidele? All these things? So in hindsight, I bet everybody goes back and goes we could have done this, but at the time, that's where we were, and the thing is the way WCW is working, then it really appeared that outside of Goldberg and Sting, but Sting was obviously already a very popular talent. Yeah, it wasn't like, hey, Bill's gonna do this guy Assaulid and put him over Nash hauled Hogan. They're huge, they're putting him over. Yeah, he's beat. I mean even when they're he's having these moments where he you know that that baby face climbed to the top, he can't really return that favor with anybody on the roster on that standpoint, the way it's being booked. So I can also see where that makes it odd. You don't have some young upcoming guy that Bill Goldberg is gonna put a rocket on like he had, right, so you're really just forced to face how could you make him lose in a way where it seems like this monster would get beat. Yeah, and at the time too, if we're being honest, that that top tier there was a lot of room for sharing. It was a very protected top tier. You were only going to get so far, so I think they kept it within that, within that inner circle of who was going to be on that top tier, and that was that was the best way for them to all do business. So uh, and I firmly believe that if Bill didn't believe in what they were saying, he wouldn't have done it. So I think he went with the game plan, and again, every everybody did business. I note to the fans and everybody outside it was very wonky and didn't really make a lot of sense. But at the end of the day, and it's like Vince says, they forgot last week. They've done what you're doing in front of him tonight. So I think that was the whopeful thing, and so far that logic pretty much holds up to this day. Yeah, And like I said, stars already established. You go to over to WWF at the time, or maybe not the exact timeline. You have people like Triple H that's being developed, you have her angle, you had the people that are already been there right Austin. But they're really all starting to boom the rock all in this couple years band, whereas ever in WCW they were still putting over the a lot of the former WWF talent, right, and it was just a whole other booking scenario that didn't exactly breed a environment where you can have a bunch of up and coming people. So right, and he actually broke through the glass Cylin in regards to that and the underlying thing within the companies or all show you and you show me. Let's not forget why Bill was the way he was. Steve Austin was told a guy in black boots and black trunks will never make a dollar. Well, Steve is now in WWF at the time, and now we're gonna take another bald headed guy in black trunks and black boots and we're gonna make him over. So it's it's you know, it's a tip for tat and okay, I'll show you and Okay, you're gonna get the better of me. Okay, well we're gonna get the better of view. So and I think that's part. I think Austin and Bill sat down and went to Austin. Podcasts have been talked about that, like they made Bill. What they said Austin couldn't be fair point One more WCW thing to talk about here, Okay, but they will kind of touch up on short WWE things. His feud with Chris Jericho, what do you remember that? So those that don't know, they did some pretty good business, but it wasn't the most favorable business for Chris Jericho, who actually had put himself in as I mean, he had kind of worked so well in the storyline, almost seemed like it was kind of a realistic thing that he could have a match with this guy. It just never happened in regards to a real actual match. I don't I don't remember much about the the behind the scenes stuff, like I said, unless you were involved in it, unless there was scuttle button they really came through the back curtains and all through that, I don't remember a lot of it. Now, when all that stuff came out and there was interviews and things like that, Dannon was going, oh oh damn, yeah, yeah, I can see. To me, to a fan, it seems like he all would have known that. Then it gets flown out of proportion. Now I'm thinking, hell, Bill Bill definitely heard about this backstage. No, I mean I knew, I knew. And and here's the thing, because Chris, let's face it, Chris, Chris is one of the best ever at anything, and so his mind was working that way, and I'm sure he had a different approach to it. And at that time, Bill's being groomed this way and being told one thing, and Chris is trying to be you know, let's well, you know this, and so there's budding of the heads. And I see that because Chris is strong, strong willed as anybody I know. But until that story came out years later, and people are even now when they talk about it, I said, back, now, go well, damn, I didn't even see that writing on the wall. I didn't see any of that happening. And so I knew there was bickering, and I knew there was lack of a better term, bad blood a little bit, and they didn't see eye to eye, But I didn't. I didn't really see that unfold because I thought what they had, the chemistry they had, was great. I thought for what they were doing in the story they were telling them, I thought it was great. Yeah. I agree, obviously they both came out all right in the end. But Chris Jericho found himself in a situation where he had gotten to a point where he's kind of getting himself over, let's be honest, which he's very capable of always and he's going up against the wrong guy at the wrong time. Yeah, And I think it goes back to a lot of well I was told this, and this is what I've been working towards, and these are the things, and now you're now you're putting the spin on this, and well, how why is my thing being interrupted by his thing? And can't we both you know, live in the same circle and all that, you know, that kind of thing. Um. But they were already into it though, right, I mean they were already in they found themselves deep into this where really they were both in a position where they could go over and benefit from it and it would be favorable. But yeah, it was just bad timing. Yeah, really, it's just yeah, it's just a bad timing, is exactly right. Obviously, Chris Jericho made some of those things like that led to him making a decision that worked out pretty well for him. Yeah, I think I think he he survived it. You'll be all right, that kid'll be okay someday. Well, we'll definitely talk more about him, and maybe you can convince him to chat with us sometime. But love it. Yeah, I've heard your conversations with him. I definitely look forward to talk more about Chris Jericho one. Yeah, I love Chubby without a doubt. Let's go. We're on the back end of this conversation now, Bill and you already mentioned ww Bill Goldberg gotes the ww how's this lining up with you? So the WWF purchases w CW and thanks start to unfold you and then go over to there to the WWF. Then Bill Goldberg doesn't come right away. Neither does a lot of people, right because they just collected money at home. Booker t comes over. What do you remember the thought being as far as Bill Goldberg is not showing up, these other guys aren't showing up. Well, they had they had guaranteed money. They all had guaranteed money. So whether they wrestled or not, they had guaranteed money. They were getting paid. And I think what the offer was was, you know, whatever pennies on the dollar to take the buy out and then come over and get your contract or whatever else. So they all have guaranteed money, so they went with they you know, what was supposed to happen and what happened two completely different things. The end of the day, the guys that initially went over the ten of us or whatever it was. The twelve of us very quickly lost favor in people's eyes, and they saw that these guys aren't stars, and we can't make them stars. So now we have to start bringing in names to make this WCW thing work. That would have been great if they would have kept WCW a separate entity from WWF, but they didn't. Here comes Booker, Here comes Dallas, Here comes Goldberg, Hereckers Mysterio, Here comes Kidman, here comes you know, all these guys and girls are coming in now, and now we're all part of WWF. So that invasion thing and everything went up in smoke, and they they felt like and because some of the people that they were dealing with at the time weren't grasping the concept of how WWF does business. They were they only knew how WCW did business. And clearly there's a miscommunication. So the ones that understood it were doing okay. The ones that weren't. It's a it's a black mark on the old group is you know, it wasn't just separating one or two people. The whole group isn't doing us for what do we have to do? Well, now we got to negotiating get these guys, you know, guys and girls to come in. And that's just the truth of it. So you who do you get? You get the top stars, you bring booker, you know, and you get a page. Right, you did the thing with the Undertaker and then Stalk and the wife and all these things and so the things that they wanted to work, but now it was all working WWF style wc W was out the window. So we were legitimately all starting over unless you know, unless they put unless they decide that you were going to be one of the one of the people the world. We'll talk more about the invasion later because I think that's an interesting story. Tried to create something that had so much potential but not the right tools to make it happen. Yeah, we'll talk more about that later. Okay, So what were you What do you remember from your career, what you were doing and what Bill Goldberg did finally make that jump very short contract, I mean, he wasn't there super long, but what do you remember when he shot up? Well, by the time Bill Bill was there, I was probably into the tough enough stuff and things like that. So a lot of my a lot of my in ring and events stuff was gone because I was doing that TV and then I started to find my niche in with the training and all those things and staying busy because they don't forget. At the time, they still had two magazine shows on the weekend. They had Heat and Velocity, right, so they had so many people. Now guys became steady Heat guys, steady Velocity guys instead of always mixing it up. And it became like WCW. No one wanted to do Thunder because Thunder was the B show until Thunder did good. Then they don't want to do Thunder, and nobody wanted to do Nitro. Well, now we're in the same thing, except now instead of one hundred guys, you have two hundred and fifty. And so now you know, well, what guys are going to keep on raw, what guys are gonna keep on SmackDown, and the rest, let's delegate them to Heat, you know, Velocity, and let's send some guys to Cincinnati with less statures group so they can help groom the younger guys. So there was always something for us to do. I just navigated the staying busy, like we worked all the live events, but we weren't working TV, and then when we weren't working TV, we did We were doing those things and then started to go to Cincinnati and all that stuff. Yeah, it kind of lines up with the tough Enough thing. Yeah is tough Enough four and the Deep South wrestling thing for you. So you spent some time on SmackDown. What do you remember people saying about when Bill Goldberg did show up? Though? That's a big thing, Like you don't know what was said between Vince Jr. At the time or Lauren IDAs and Goldberg. So everybody, again, it's all assumptions. Well, this guy thinks he's gonna get the same treatment and do the same things. And but there's a certain way of doing things in a WWF, and no matter how big you are, there's a way to get acclimated, right. And so I'm not sure if Edge were budding or whatever the case was. I have no I have no insider information on that. I just know that it was a different It was a different place than where everybody came from. And Bill didn't have a lot of independent stuff under his belt. He didn't have a lot of international stuff. He knew WCW's way and what he did and what worked for him there, and so whether he was told that was the same thing that was going to happen, You've got to work your way into that stuff, you know. So I know his for his first time in wasn't really long, and probably it's probably just a decision of you know, I just don't want to do business like this, or both sides. Clearly both sides have come to understanding. He's on mutual occasions, so it all works out in the wash. But I just feel like when everybody came up from wc W, including Bill, including Page, including everyone, name anybody you want, including a Steiner's, you were only gonna do so much, but you were gonna do it WWF way. Yeah, what's the old saying, the winner's right history? Yeah, and he was not part of the A lot of the the the winning efforts of the Triple h is the Stone Colds. He was on the other side of it. So regardless, at the end of the day, w W gets the right history and that was all new to Bill. Yeah, and so perception comes in, now, well, how do I look into public eye? What has this done to my to my legacy? You know, I'm sure all those things came into play. Yeah, he does some stuff, but to sum it all up, he has a a really bad match with brock Lessner. Yeah. Both guys are in a position on their way out. Oh yeah, I don't know how that happened, but and it's just a it's a bad match. It's dangerous, it's sloppy, it's bad. Do you remember this match? Oh? I remember it. I remember watching it, and and I just think that match was going to be what it was no matter what. I think both both guys had a mindset going in and and you said it, at the end of the day, they were thumbed, they were walking away, And so that's the one that Steve was refeing, right, Steve was the referee. He demanded a rematch at Wrestlingmania twelve. Austin was a special guest referee. Yep, yeah, yep, you're right, Yeah, Steve was. That's right. So you got two guys on their way out, one guy who's gotta keep his legacy. Go. I mean, you got three three monster characters in there, and they've all got to save face, and it just it just didn't jail. It just and I think at that point everybody knew it and it was gonna be what it was because at WrestleMania, the tickets are already sold. There. There wasn't gonna be any backlash other than fans not liking it or something. But the tickets were sold. So you're gonna get the match. You we're gonna get And that was the end of it. Yeah, And I honestly, the match was so bad I forgot that Steve Austin was even in it. It was bad. But like you said, you worked yourself in a hole both as we're leaving, what do you do? But just to sum it up here, we're getting really close to the end. Twenty sixteen, Bill Goldberg comes back and it's a pretty damn good redemption thing that he did about seven years ago. Now that was pretty big for him. Yeah, he seemed like a different guy. He seemed yeah, different feeling about wrestling in life and everything. He had a child, you know, he had a son, and there it is. He came back and kicked ass. He came back, He came out and said it right, he wars his feeling going to see he wanted to show his son what he had done, what people recognize them for. Let's pay Bill at TV shows, He had car shows. Bill has been in movies, Bill has done other things, but he wanted to show his son. And so that's a great motivator. And the time of way. And I always feel like the time of way we spend away from the business makes us smarter to the business. So if you get a chance to go back in now you can you can handle things differently and you're motivated. And the reaction it was enough motivation because that was a great that was a great return. Obviously, the Hall of Fame danced down. He was first ballot Hall of Famer. When it's all said and done, what to you, if you could define it? Do you think Bill Goldberg's legacy will be known as a wrestler intense? He was a machine. I mean he made a statement from from day one. He made a statement and he kept that the whole his whole career. He was known. There was no changing of the persona. There wasn't like sting change his face, paint changed, his hair, went to the crow thing, went to this, Ogan nWo Good, Ogan, Savage. All these guys did things to reinvent themselves. He maintained who he was his whole career and the way he started was the way he finished. Yeah. His legacy is is this simple Goldberg. That's his legacy. One word defines this guy and who he is. You don't need him. Anybody who follows this sport, whether they follow it now or they go back and look at it, there's no explanation needed when you hear Goldberg universally known. Yeah. Yeah, he obviously has made a lot of money since he's come back to He had a great match I thought at Russellmanni with Brock Lesner. You know that that sort of redemption match, right, Yeah, it was of such a short match, but it was perfect for what it needed to be for him to win. It was simple, it was perfect, It was simple. The intensity showed because both guys are extremely intense, perfectly executed, and that's like a redemption match for the one of the worst matches when I think of that's actually one of the worst matches, but redemptions there. Bill Goldberg's hands down a Hall of famer, and like I just said, he's continued to make quite a bit of money coming in and out the last several years. Saudi Arabia randomly with Drew McIntyre, Bill Goldberg has had a significant ending to his career at a as an aged individual and wrestling terms. So hands down to him there. Yeah, you have to appreciate and even at the later points with Saudi and everything else, you have to appreciate his willingness to put himself out there and to get himself in the shape he's gotten himself in to come back. He didn't cover up, he didn't hide, he didn't change anything. He's been billed the whole time, and so it's nice to see it happen that way, because right there's ebbs and flows in every career, but it's nice to see it end that way. And I don't know if his goal was ever to get into the WWE Hall of Fame, but I think he's accomplished everything he set out to do. And that's where you got to take your hat off to him, because if he said he was going to do it and put his mind to it, he did it. Whether you whether people liked it or not, whether you agreed with it, whether he whether you legitimately had heat with him in the back, or you didn't like him as a person. The man put his put his nose to the grindstone and did what he set out to do. That's to me, that's that's the definition of a Hall of Fame career. Absolutely So in future episodes, hopefully we can get some listen or interaction. They can go to send emails to build demot pod at gmail dot com. But for this episode, actually had a friend that wanted me to ask you a question. Okay, kind of spilled the beans on it earlier. I dropped the name Gilberg. He was curious what he thought about Gilberg and that whole character. I feel like that's that's when you reach a certain point of success, there's got to be a parody, especially the WW they they proved it over the years. If you've been successful, there's a parody, whether d X was doing a parody of someone or or um, you know, like they were doing with UM oh my gosh, the Nation of Domination and all these things. Wc W did it with parodies. And I think the knock while it could have been offensive to Bill because he was a very serious and very strong will Pat, I think it's it's a sign of respect. I think it's a sign of respect and and got pless Dwayne forgetting another run at it, you know, I mean the Gilberg thing is great, and God bless him for doing it and making it work and putting it what it was. I mean, if anybody looks at it past what it truly is, because it put a smile on everybody's face. And whether whether and I can't speak for Bill, so I won't whether he took it personally or not great business. And I think it's a side of when you truly become successful, as when they make a par If weird ol can make a parody of all the songs and everything he's done, then why shouldn't we be able to make a parody of one of the strongest personalities in wrestling in the past thirty years. I liked it. I thought it was funny as hell. I enjoyed it every time it was funny as hell. Speaking of respect, Bill, like we started this conversation off with Goldberg, you played a hach part in that and other things that you probably don't get talked about enough for in my opinion, and I wanted to let you know that I have a hell oot respect for you, and when I think of Bill Goldberg, I'll often think of you as well. I don't necessarily not with you with gil Goldberg sometimes the other way around. Like I said, I think about if things didn't go exactly like they did, the end result could have been different. For let's be honest, a lot of the wrestling industry, particularly Bill Goldberg's career and various other things. So I will nod my head to you and nod my hat to you and tell you have a helloat of respect for you for that. Well, thank you man. Like I said, it's uh, I never want it, never once lost my mind to go into business for myself or anything. And I just looked at it is that was my job. But and I said at the beginning, it was an honor to be a part of it. And if that's part of my wrestling legacy, I wholeheartedly accept it. And I appreciate Bill and everything he's done and and if I if I had the opportunity to do it the way he did, I would have done it. Hats off to him. But I appreciate the kind words, and I think that the biggest thing in wrestling to me has always been that respect. And as long as you have the respect of the guys and the people you work with, then you know the dirt sheet still matter and all these other things. As long as you know, at the end of the day, you're doing you and it's what you were told and what you're asked and what you know. The rest is easy. But like we talk about all the time, offline and stuff, you got to navigate so many other opinions and this and that. So as people think as easy, it was a journey for Bill. All the things that he had to go through to get to that point, I'm sure very taxing on him personally as well as the other guys. And I know we'll well, we'll talk about this as long as we're talking. You know, it's always gonna be coming back to how perception is with people. But I appreciate the kind words and the utmost respect for Bill and everything. So this was a good conversation. Man. I really enjoyed this absolutely. Yeah, hell of a fun time. I think this is gonna be well received. This should be This is a significant point that people need to think about. And I'm just having hell of the time making a podcast with you. Man. I'm excited to release episodes every Wednesday. Every Wednesday. Yeah, this is this is gonna be awesome. We're gonna we're gonna have. We're gonna have a lot of fun, and I'm sure we're gonna have a couple of deep conversations as we go too. But this as long as they end like this every time because I love reliving what I've been a part of and the things in the history of this business. And then it makes me think about the things I've missed. So now I'm gonna be Now I'm gonna be watching more stuff to catch up on some of the things we talked about, just to remind myself of what we did, because you I think we get lost in what we what we're gonna do next, and we don't appreciate what we did. So this is this is really cool and I'm glad we're doing this. Man. This is fun, absolutely and we hope you're enjoying listening to it. If you are haven't already, please follow or subscribe to build him on Experience wherever you find your podcast or video form on YouTube. Build DeMont pod at gmail dot com. We'd love to hear from your social media everything like that, and tell us what you thought, what you want to hear, and all that good stuff, and go to buildt dot com to hear more. Bill again. Man, I think I'm thinking you for another amazing conversation and we're going to keep them coming until. Thank you. I appreciate it sending those questions in thanks everybody. Don't let my mother if your man, your sweat to be shining, make the best to yourself, don't you. Sprandi shown your all out the time, truly shining. Some town room wattles Jeff Counting media batt
