Nightmare Before Christmas Valley by PNW Haunts & Homicides

[00:00:00] Listener discretion is advised. Hello and welcome to Scary Time, the podcast that helps you find new, emerging and undiscovered scary and paranormal podcasts. I'm Greg, the host and curator of Scary Time. I hope everyone's had a great holiday season and you've enjoyed this additional content

[00:00:19] to help you get through the holidays. On Monday we will be back to one episode a week. Today's episode is from PNW Haunts and Homicides. Caitlin and Cassie cover true crime, paranormal and all things spooky in the Pacific Northwest.

[00:00:37] Caitlin and Cassie picked this episode out specifically for you on the holidays. It's called, The Nightmare Before Christmas Valley. If you liked today's episode, make sure to check out the episode description for links to subscribe. Alright, let's get this show started. Begin! Hi, Caitlin. Hi, Cassie.

[00:01:37] Hi, creepy people. Hello! I hope you're having a holly jolly time. Oh God. I've turned full elf. Oh dear. Yeah. It's terrifying. Okay. Did you see my outfit? Yeah. It says, Santa stop judging me. I mean, I think that's fitting. Like, who is he to judge anyway? Seriously.

[00:02:03] I think I wore this last year too. I've had this a while. Yeah, I think you did. As you can tell, it's very worn. Is it? Well, I think it's kind of like that burnout. I can't remember what that's called.

[00:02:17] I always think of it as like a burnout fabric and that's kind of what it's supposed to look like. It is, but it's when I got it, it was very, it was a lot pinker. Okay. Yeah.

[00:02:30] The good thing is with that type of clothing you can never really tell. That's true. It's perfect. Oh wait, hold on. This is PNW Hansen Homicide. Oh, shit. I almost forgot, but I didn't. Yeah. Here we are. I have gone full theme. Are you ready?

[00:02:55] Are you creepy people ready? What? I just had an idea about what you're doing and... Because you looked at my notes. I didn't. What do you think I'm doing? Ooh, this is gonna be fun. I don't know. Guess, what do you think?

[00:03:08] I don't, well if you're going full theme it's gotta be something like Christmas-y, I'm thinking. Maybe. Oh God. Alright, let's rip this band-aid off. I've got my foot ready. The other one is ready to join it in the chair. Okay. It should be the knee to rise.

[00:03:25] It's not gonna be like Christmas Carol type of ghost. Okay. So there's not three of them? Is that... We're not... No. Actually, there might not be any ghosts in this episode. Excellent. Okay, well let's just work with that assumption and I think we're done here. Okay, let's go.

[00:03:48] Let's get into it. Ho ho ho, let's go. Oh no, I meant like done-done. No. We have to talk about it. My socks say ho ho oh no, I think. Oh boy. Ho ho ho no. They're so cute. They're in my memory before Christmas.

[00:04:09] Today we're gonna talk about Christmas Valley. Never heard of her. It's in Oregon. Still never heard of her. Really? No, never. I don't think so. Well, I'm gonna tell you about it. Okay. Christmas Valley is an unincorporated community. Surprise, surprise. No, everything unincorporated. It's not good.

[00:04:34] Incorporate these things. I know, please. Incorporate them. It's in Southern Oregon, roughly 95 miles southeast of Bend. Yeah, okay. Now I'm getting a real vibe here. Yep. Okay. Starting to picture it. Okay. Population of 1313. Stop it. Isn't that creepy? Like, how can they be so exact?

[00:05:01] I don't know but that's the number that popped up on the goog. Wow. Yeah. 1313 people live there. That's fine. You know how I feel about the number 13. I know. That's why I was like really shocked when I saw that. I was like, oh, I wasn't expecting that.

[00:05:20] That's great. But it goes with the theme of the town, surprisingly. In this town you'll find a charming lodge style restaurant that could be considered Christmas looking. It's got the, you know, traditional lodge feel, the wood, you know.

[00:05:39] I feel like I'm watching a horror movie and I'm just waiting for the jump scare. I'm like watching you through my fingers. She is. Yeah. Like wait for it. Wait for it. You'll see street signs like Snowman Road. Oh cute. I know. That's cute.

[00:06:03] Christmas tree lane and glitter lane. Well, I mean glitter to be fair that could just be like Mariah Carey's hallway. Oh, I mean it could be or it could be like pretty glittery twinkle lights. I mean, sure. Tinsel. Yeah. Ribbon. Bows. Glitter snow. Okay.

[00:06:30] I don't know why, but whatever you say it then it's scary. And it sounds creepy when you say it. Well, that's about the extent of the Christmas charm in this town though. Great.

[00:06:50] You won't find any Christmas parades or light displays or long lines to sit on an imposter Santa's lap. I mean, I'm okay with that. That's fine. We could do it without the Santa's lap I think. Yeah. I think it's overstated welcome. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:07:09] There's not even a stoplight in the town to mistake for Rudolph's nose. Wow. Wow. That's when you know that you've had far more eggnog than is safe. It's honestly almost like this town was hit by the Grinch. There's not even a crumb left for the mouse or whatever.

[00:07:38] What you will find here are landmarks surrounding Christmas Valley with less than jolly names. Okay. Are you ready? Probably not, but... There's a spot called Crack in the Ground. Okay. Another called Hole in the Ground. What? They're very clever with their naming.

[00:08:00] I mean, did you find this when you were working on Mel's Hole? Actually no, but it did remind me of that. But we're not going to go down the whole road of holes. Oh boy. So the Crack in the Hole were caused by volcanoes.

[00:08:17] There's nothing really paranormal or spooky about them, but you can hike through the Crack and I'm sure it's pretty creepy. But I don't think you can enter the hole. Okay. It's not haunted, says you. Not that I've heard.

[00:08:39] I didn't find any stories of hauntings, but I'm sure some weird shit goes down. Are you sure that there weren't any hikers hiking through the Crack that expired? They got lost in the Crack because it was so deep. Oh boy. Okay, we're done probably. Maybe. Maybe.

[00:09:01] There's even more landmarks that don't have a Christmasy theme or anything. There is The Lost Forest and The Devil's Garden Lava Bed. Oh boy. So if you can see, there's a vibe around this town and it's not Jingle Belly whatsoever.

[00:09:22] I feel like we're playing a game of hot and cold. Kind of, yeah. Either it's Christmasy or it's not. It's Jingle Hell. Oh. This town is also well known for its sand dunes, which is exactly the opposite of a Christmas snowy vibe. Yeah.

[00:09:44] Do you want to build a sand man? No. No. I don't. I really, really don't. It was kind of eerie too when I was reading about that place. They said the service there is not great, so make sure you download the map so you

[00:10:05] don't get lost in the dunes. No. I would not be going very far into the dunes. Yeah. No, that's not for me. Just stay on the edges. Or just as far away as possible. You don't want to go to the dunes? Totally up to you.

[00:10:22] It's like on the outer edge or just as far away as you can get. We can make a sand angel. No thanks. Well, speaking of lost. Let's talk about that lost forest for a second. Okay. Now this area is prairie land, sagebrush, tumbleweeds, that kind of stuff.

[00:10:46] Getting a vibe? Yeah. I thought for a second that you were going to say you wanted to talk about the TV show lost and all of a sudden I was like, oh my god, I figured it out. This is my nightmare. I need to wake up. Wake up.

[00:11:06] But there used to be a lake and a ton of fertile land here. There is evidence of that with a thinly populated island of Ponderosa Pines. Oh, it's like a little tree island?

[00:11:21] So think about it like in the middle of this prairie land, there's like a big, not like a huge piece of land, but there's a decent sized piece of land with like sparsely populated trees. So it's not like a dense island of trees. Okay.

[00:11:38] I kind of thought it looked like a graveyard of what the land used to be. Like it used to be all of these fertile healthy trees, but now it's just like sparse. I keep saying sparse. Oh my god. Spirey. Can I think of a different word?

[00:11:52] Do you know what I mean in Google and the internet? Sparse. Scanty. Scant. Scant. Scant. Scantily. Sporadic. Skimby. Mega. Paltry. Okay. There's just a bunch of skimpy trees around. They do look skimpy though. They do like their legs are bare, their chest is exposed. Okay.

[00:12:17] Well, do these trees have an only fans or what? Maybe. It's starting to sound a little bit sexy. I make everything sexual. I don't know why. Yeah, you really do. I need to calm down. Yeah. Anywho. Close by is Fossil Lake, which is pretty self-explanatory I feel like.

[00:12:40] Sort of. Do they find a lot of fossils? They find a fair amount of fossils there. Okay. Yeah. It used to be around 200 feet deep. Now there's no water in it. Oh. And you can find fossils of over 100 different species there. Really? Yes. That's so cool. Mammoth. Mammoth.

[00:13:02] Mammoth. We all know I can't say TH and S. Yeah. I'm leaving it. It's fine. You can also find fossils of giant beavers. Stop it. And dire wolves. Wait. Which I'm not going to lie, I thought dire wolves were like dragons and unicorns. Okay. Yeah.

[00:13:22] I literally was about to be like, if this is a stupid question, you have to cut it out, but dire wolves are real. That's what I thought too. Like I feel like this is another narwhal situation. Wait. It's an extinct canine. I had no idea.

[00:13:37] Oh my God, you guys, if I'd known dire wolves were real, we would already be fucked as the human race because I definitely would have Jurassic Parked our asses. Holy fuck. I know I want a dire wolf so bad. It looks huge. That's kind of the point.

[00:13:57] I know I want a puppy that I can ride. I want a ghost. It combines my favorite things. It's a puppy horse. It's a horse puppy. Love it. I want one. We're going to have to go back in time for that. Get to work on that time machine.

[00:14:14] Creepy people, I know we can figure it out. Yeah. Oh my God. What? This is so weird. Blah blah blah blah blah. So they were like native to North America. It's prey is known to have included Western horses, mastodons. Holy shit. Ancient bison, camels and ground sloths.

[00:14:45] They had camels here? I thought maybe that's their prey in a different area. When you say ground sloth, I definitely thought of sloth burgers. Sloth burgers. Like ground meat. Like ground meat and formed into sloth burgers. I thought you were getting confused and calling Rolf sloth.

[00:15:11] I thought you were remembering the Rolf burger thing. Rolf burgers. Oh my God, that was so funny. I, oh my God. This is a lot. Close it so you don't get distracted. Anyways, I just thought you would want to know. I did want to know. Thank you.

[00:15:35] You're so welcome. Okay. There's also a place called Fort Rock where they found a cave with 10,000 year old Sagebrush sandals. This is some of the earliest evidence of humans in North America. Jeez. So pretty cool. That's really cool. Now I want some Sagebrush sandals. I know, yeah.

[00:15:58] And if you're interested in obsidian, I am. Right? Which like who doesn't want some dragon glass? You can collect some at the Glass Buttes. Oh cool. And I always call Buttes butts because I'm fine. Glass butts. Glass butts.

[00:16:18] But yeah, you can go there and they just let anyone come and collect whatever obsidian they want. Oh that's cool. Yeah. In Oregon we have actually a few different places where it's like totally free.

[00:16:32] It's just open to the public and it's you don't need a permit or anything. I think that's really cool. I know I want to go so bad. Let's do it. Road trip. Jesus, you're terrifying sometimes. The town doesn't have the best luck.

[00:16:51] They've tried to populate it a few times and it just never works out. Leading to abandoned properties, which is creepy. They even have an abandoned Air Force station. Oh my gosh. This is actually kind of exciting because I bet you that property is almost cheap

[00:17:15] enough that some of us millennials that still aren't homeowners, which is most of us probably. Yeah. We might be able to almost afford. Maybe almost. But it's very secluded. It's a very secluded area. There's not a lot going on there.

[00:17:34] I think they just like recently got a doctor in the town. Well in the unincorporated community. Yeah. I think there was, I didn't read a ton about it but. They incorporated a medical practitioner into their unincorporated community. It's probably just one. You have to go to his house.

[00:17:53] Yeah. It's done in his basement. No, I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. Okay. They dropped like 275 million to build this Air Force facility during the Cold War. Oh boy. Right? And then in this tiny town that much money was dumped into it. Okay.

[00:18:17] I feel like that explains a lot. It does and it keeps getting better. Oh good. When they finally finished it, the war ended. So it was left abandoned, never used. That's great. Yep.

[00:18:34] And all of the jobs that that place would have created were just kind of out the window. So I think a bunch of people left too. So is this an empty military base? So there's facilities. There's a huge building, probably more like a complex. Huh. Interesting.

[00:18:54] Tell me more about how we have these hundreds of million dollars that went into these buildings and we can't house the unhoused. Huh. I think so. I didn't read a ton about it, but I think they use it for storage.

[00:19:12] And then I think they were going to try to use it for something at one point. There was an article about Obama talking about using it for something, but I really don't know. Interesting. So it's like the military's walking closet in their vacation home. Yeah.

[00:19:31] Sounds like it as far as I know. Cool. So I think that's how it, if anyone helps. If anyone else knows, please email me. Yeah. So I just feel like this town just has such bad luck and it's just not merry and bright, you guys.

[00:19:50] It doesn't sound like it. It's so depressing for a town called Christmas Valley. Although you could be walking in a mid-summer winterland because it's been known to snow in July. Christmas in July. That's about as Christmassy as it gets down there. We should go for our birthday.

[00:20:09] We could. Yeah. I'm not sure how this was talking about unpredictable weather patterns kind of back when they were trying to populate the town back in the day. Huh. So I'm not sure if the weather, I'm assuming it's pretty unpredictable out there. It's kind of like desert. Yeah.

[00:20:28] I've never heard of snow in July down south though. Yeah. In July. I don't know, man. July. That's what the article said. Here's the thing. We have nothing to lose because if we go down there in July and it's warm and pleasant and beautiful. That's fine. Fucking fabulous.

[00:20:48] If we manifest mother fucking birthday snow in July. I think we could do it. I think we could lose my mind. I manifested snow with our last episode. Holy shit. It snowed the day it came out. Yeah. Okay. I think this is, we gotta redoing this happen. Yep.

[00:21:09] Snow in July, Christmas Valley meet us there. We got big plans. Yeah. The weather isn't the only thing that's unusual here though. There's been reports of big foot sightings, strange cattle mutilations. No. I know and unusual lights moving strangely and blinking in the sky. Okay.

[00:21:42] One of these reports takes place at 8 30 PM, January 7th, 2009, which seems like forever ago. Yeah. It's a long last time ago. On a clear, crisp night during a full moon, obviously, four people witnessed approximately 15 round, extremely bright lights behaving oddly in the sky. 15? 15. Approximately 15.

[00:22:15] So it was probably actually 13. I think they said more than 15. Wow. That's crazy. I'm going to read you a quote about these lights from United States UFO dot blogspot.com. Okay. Okay. After the first light appeared, then there was a second light right beside it, then a third

[00:22:38] and a fourth all in a row. After the fourth light appeared, the first one burned out following the rest right in order as they appeared. So it's like one's showing up, one's blinking out and it keeps going. Oh, weird.

[00:22:53] At one point or another, one light would dim just enough where we could still see it and we watched as it darted one way then stop and slowly take another direction. Oh, weird. Yeah. The dimmed lights seemed as if they were playing slowly and then picking up speed,

[00:23:14] lighting up and dimming at any given time. That's so weird. Yeah. They later describe them as behaving like fireflies. Well, and what's really funny to me about kind of that account is normally when you

[00:23:29] think about these kind of UFO type sightings, people point to like, oh, could it be a military exercise? Right. But we know that area doesn't have an operating base or any type of actual facility that's functioning.

[00:23:46] Unless it's like a secret underground facility and then they're flying things at night. Oh, shnapp. Oh, but this person said that they didn't hear any aircraft. There was no fireworks or flares happening.

[00:24:02] So yeah, that's the thing that's freaky is you could think maybe it would be an aircraft as we know it here on earth. But when it's like silent, yeah, too, that just doesn't. It's so creepy. Yeah.

[00:24:15] I mean, and if it is secret government stuff they're working on like that's pretty cool. So yeah, cool. We're way further advanced in technology than I thought. Yeah. So that's great. I feel more safe when the aliens come. No.

[00:24:35] There is a comment on a blog post on archive.lyza.com. I wanted to read it because I think it's pretty interesting and maybe Caitlin can sleuth it out for us. Oh boy. Yeah.

[00:24:52] So Carolyn says my visit to Christmas Valley was 30 years ago, but I will never forget the vast open lonely feeling and all those tumble weeds. Even more creepy was the cemetery that we visited. Nope. I'm out. Of course she is. I'll wait till I tell you the rest.

[00:25:13] That held what must have been half the town that was killed in a fire at the Grange Hall during a Christmas party. Anyone know about it? Question mark? What? Yeah. So I did not look this up because I don't know, it felt too depressing for Christmas.

[00:25:36] So I'm like, but maybe if Caitlin likes that shit. Exactly. So she finds something about it. Maybe we could bring it back up for Christmas in July or something that's not actually Christmas. Oh boy. Do we, I mean, does it sound like it was a crime?

[00:25:54] I don't know. All I read about it was this comment. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So who knows? Since the story was a bit on the short side, I wanted to stay on theme and talk about one more thing.

[00:26:07] Caitlin, what do you think is the most Christmassy crystal or stone? I don't know. She doesn't know. Snowflake obsidian? Yeah. I was like, we were literally just talking about it earlier. We were.

[00:26:21] It came in a little pack of crystals that we got, a little jar of snowflake obsidian, which I thought was kind of weird because you don't usually see that and I knew I was about to talk about it today. Oh. So I set it on our altar.

[00:26:34] I was going to say, I might have to look in some of the other crystals that we have for our little displays and maybe even in the crystal vending machine and see if there's more. Ooh. Snowflake obsidian. Yeah, there might be. Pretty.

[00:26:49] So for those of you that don't know, this is a black stone with little white spots on it that looks like snowflakes. Yeah. It's cute. It's so cute.

[00:27:00] I think they're so beautiful and I actually just purchased one for a friend the other day when I visited through the veil. Oh, yeah. I think we talked about it because I got my new supernatural tarot deck from there too. Yes. Yeah.

[00:27:16] So like regular obsidian, this is also volcanic glass with white minerals that have gotten trapped on the inside. Pretty. I know. The stone represents balance and is good for grounding and purification. Oh, okay. It helps keep you centered and focused while all hell is breaking loose apparently.

[00:27:37] So I feel like we all could use a snowflake obsidian. Yeah. It also represents lightness in the dark and can help you look inward for strength and tough times. It shields negative energy as well. Oh, I like that. Me too. It can be useful during healing meditations.

[00:27:58] It surfaces repressed trauma. Yikes. Oh, okay. But I mean it's important to deal with that. Yeah. I don't think I should, I probably won't get one of those. I mean just don't go into deep meditation with it if you're not ready. Oh, that won't be a problem. Yeah.

[00:28:14] Okay. Never mind. I also get you into a deeper meditative state which is helpful for trying to reach past life memories, which I think is really interesting. Yeah. It helps with physical health of the bones and the skin as well. Okay.

[00:28:32] So it's actually describing the very stone that I need. I just want to bathe in it. Yeah. That's so funny because I literally was just telling you about the weird knee stuff that's going on. Yeah. I'm like, yeah, you don't have that? No. Great. Not yet. Oh boy.

[00:28:54] It's pretty cool too. It says that charging this stone with fire is especially effective since it came from a volcano. Shut up. I've never heard that you can do that. Me neither. I just learned. Okay.

[00:29:10] So what you can do is place your obsidian in the center of a circle of lit candles for an hour or two or however long you want to safely burn candles for and charge your crystal. Hell yeah. Yeah. I knew you would like that because it's fire.

[00:29:24] I love fire. Do you want to play with fire with me? Yes. Yay. Let's go play with fire in the garage. Yeah. Woo. Let's go charge our obsidian in the garage. Well, that's all I have for this kind of Christmasy episode that's not very Christmasy.

[00:29:45] You know what though? This is so funny because I had no idea that you were going to be talking about a crystal with this and I wanted to do a couple of different things kind of bring out some

[00:30:00] of the crystals that I haven't used in our altar recently and I actually made a little crystal grid. I sat here and probably spent a half hour trying to figure out what exactly I wanted to do.

[00:30:13] But I made a little crystal grid so I'm going to put it out for the tarot video and man, we've got quite the display going here. I know. I almost wish I would have bought one of those snowflake obsidians for myself so I could show it off.

[00:30:28] No kidding. I was shopping for other people so. Oh, you're so good. I bought myself a tarot deck. Yeah, that's true. So I'm not that good. I mean, but like who wants to be that good? Right. You know? Well, should we do a tarot reading for this? Tarot!

[00:30:47] Yeah. Yay. We're doing tarot for Christmas Valley. Christmas Valley. With my nightmare before Christmas deck. Correct. I did a few pre-shuffling. Okay, I think I'm going to draw. I think I did it. Get it girl, get it.

[00:31:12] I'm just feeling the deck out where I want to cut it. It's like right here. Okay. Oh, yeah. We got some movers and shakers. You got like two cards right there. I do. Is this? No, this is one. I know, but these two like slid together.

[00:31:32] It's not those. Oh, okay. All right. Okay. It's the five of needles or swords in reverse and it's oogie boogie and jack fighting. It doesn't look like a great card. Interesting. Okay. It kind of looks like it's in a spiky like cave like it could be a volcano.

[00:31:54] I was going to say like depending on how hair flip it the other way that almost looks like they could be trees. Oh, like depending on how you look at it, it could be either. Yeah. Interesting. It's a little bit like almost abstract. Oh yeah.

[00:32:14] I'm like we have a thing for the card. Okay. So five of swords are keywords are change, adjustment, loss, destruction, conflict, indecision and sadness. Kind of sounds like the town of Christmas Valley. I guess so. Unfortunately.

[00:32:38] The number five signifies change and this card shows a time of adjustment after a conflict of some kind. Like the Cold War. And the first time they try to like settle there. They realized how harsh the land was because it wasn't the fertile late land anymore.

[00:32:58] It was kind of the dry prairie land. So they realized that they couldn't make a living off of that land and left. Yeah. That's oh my gosh. Yeah, that's interesting.

[00:33:10] It would be really hard to settle there in the days of, you know, the old time is, oh my goodness. Okay. Sometimes the fight stems from ideological or spiritual differences. Okay. Yeah. I think that means the Cold War.

[00:33:28] There was also a man too that tried to kind of build up the town. He built like a golf course and things and tried to get a bunch of real estate going and then that ended up not working out.

[00:33:39] So can you imagine how much it costs to irrigate a golf course? I know. It's kind of crazy. The writer, Wait Smith Aquarian and some other decks show a soldier on the battlefield at the end of a fight. Oh, the card asks what have you won or lost?

[00:34:02] So again, I say to you. 275 mil. Lost. Couple books. That's kind of really weird. The end of a battle and the Cold War. Wow. Wow. Wow. Wow. Reverse the five suggests pretty much the same thing as it does upright. Okay. Excellent.

[00:34:29] When the card appears reversed in a reading, however, you may feel a great sense of remorse, regret or unhappiness. Sometimes it shows you making repairs or reparations after a conflict, trying to set things right again and learning from your suffering. Huh. Interesting. Okay. I've learned nothing.

[00:34:55] Maybe there is hope for Christmas Valley. Yeah. That'd be nice. They're like, all we need is a few gullible millennials looking to own a home. I'm sure everyone who lives there and loves the nice peace and quiet is just going to love that. Yeah.

[00:35:12] They're like, please bring us some hipster cold brew. Stop talking about us on your pod. In a reading about money, the reversed five can indicate losses after a fight. Jesus fucking Christ. Weird. That is so weird. Actually the cold brew.

[00:35:34] Perhaps a legal matter or squabble over an inheritance. In the end, no one really wins. There was something in there about someone who inherited some land that, okay, I might be crazy because there wasn't a lot, but I feel like it was someone who inherited

[00:35:52] a land that their ancestor had and had been paying taxes on but never went to the land to build a house or anything. He just had laid in a Christmas Valley. Yeah. So it's just this like kind of unsettled property. Yeah. Interesting.

[00:36:08] Which most of the properties there are unsettled. I would say. Oh my goodness. And you may experience regret. Indecision or unwillingness to make necessary changes could be costly too. So interesting. Like maybe the government takes the property bag or something like that because they never built on it.

[00:36:28] Yeah. That'd be interesting. You guys, I have a new hyper focus. If the reading is about your job, struggles with bosses or coworkers may cause hard feelings or impede your progress. A conflict may damage your chances for advancement, perhaps causing you to change jobs under unfavorable circumstances.

[00:36:52] Well, they did lose out on a lot of jobs when that complex was never opened by the military. Interesting. Same. Okay. In a reading about love, this card can indicate mourning the loss of a relationship or regretting a decision made in the heat of an argument.

[00:37:12] Perhaps you feel betrayed. In some cases, however, it can suggest trying to repair the damage and make constructive changes, perhaps with the help of therapy. Oh, okay. Go to therapy, Mr. Gorbachev. Oh boy. Oh boy.

[00:37:34] I'm going to grab our little crystal bread because nobody knew this was coming and probably Lindsay's forgotten that she even mentioned this, but I made her a crystal grid. Aww, you're so sweet. It's so cute. So I'll post a picture of it for Lindsay on the Patreon.

[00:37:59] Aww, I really like it. Yeah. It's something that she mentioned from our Facebook Live and so I have had in probably three different places. Like I wrote a sticky note, I had an email I sent myself and then it was in the Notes app

[00:38:20] and I wanted to put together a little crystal grid for her and we just got this little guy and it just, see now you can see it. Now you can see the grid. Yeah, don't light it a fire though. I know, yeah.

[00:38:34] All right, we're going to set all of the things back down. We won't play with fire anymore. Well, I think that was successful. I think so too. I was feeling like that might be a really tough episode to get like a good read on the card.

[00:38:51] Yeah, I wasn't sure where it was going to go. Hilarious. All right, is there any closing statements you would like to make? Just the use. Have a creepy ass Christmas. We'll see you next Tuesday though for more, maybe more Christmas stuff. We don't know.

[00:39:13] I'm, you know, we never know. We never know. Come back and find out. Bye. Get some snowflake obsidian. So for all of you that are listening, if you have any true crime or paranormal stories that you want us to share, maybe with the whole Pacific Northwest.

[00:39:35] Yes, we would love to read them on the pod. Yes, we will read them out loud. Not just in our heads. Yes. They don't have to be from the Pacific Northwest. If you would like to share email us at P N W hunts and homicides at gmail.com.

[00:39:56] It's all spelled out. No special characters. Super duper easy peasy. Follow us on Instagram and Facebook. Same thing as the email at P N W hunts and homicides all spelled out. No special characters. Please also rate and review us on whatever platform you're listening to

[00:40:16] and check out our stories on social media because our main game is hot. Agreed. And if you agree like Caitlin, you can also find us on Patreon and support the show. Bitchen. It's not going to be like fuck. What's that movie? Crampus. No, the movie with the ghosts.

[00:41:16] Casper. No, the popular Christmas movie with the Scrooge. What the fuck is that called? The three ghosts one. Scrooge. What's the Scrooge movie called? I don't know. You guys, what is wrong with my brain? The... The... Okay Google. Christmas Scrooge. Ghosts of Christmas Pass?

[00:41:42] Yeah, but like that's not what it's called. Oh yeah, it's uh, oh my god. I can literally only think of like these vague themes related to it right now. I've seen it a thousand times. Multiple different... Scrooge. Ebenezer Scrooge? Yeah, what's the... Christmas Carol. Christmas Carol.

[00:42:03] Is that what it is? Christmas Carol. Oh yeah, it is. Okay, I never would have gotten there. It's happening. Oh wow, that really hurts me. Okay, moving on. Well let me say that right. Thanks again for listening to Scary Time by Indie Drop-In Network.

[00:42:24] If you would like to nominate a scary or paranormal podcast to be featured, just send me a tweet at Indie Drop-In. I'd also love to hear if one of our featured podcasts is now your favorite show. Indie Drop-In survives off ad revenue and listener donations.

[00:42:41] If you would like to contribute, please consider buying me a coffee. You can go to buymeacoffee.com forward slash Indie Drop-In. If you look at the very bottom of the episode description, you will see a link to make it easy.

[00:42:54] Indie Drop-In also has many other shows you might like. Just go to IndieDrop-In.com. See you next week.