The Cheat Sheet: Jingles and Justice

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[00:03:16] [SPEAKER_03] I'm Anya, and today on The Cheat Sheet, we're going to be doing two cold cases and two murder-suicides. Content warning, this episode contains discussion of murder, violence, and suicide, including the murder of children.

[00:03:32] [SPEAKER_00] You know, Anya, I was thinking, it's like every week on this program, people are getting ready to go out and enjoy a happy weekend. And maybe they're doing something by themselves, maybe with friends, maybe with family. And it's like we're saying, wait a minute, before you go out, we want to tell you some really awful things.

[00:03:55] [SPEAKER_03] That's the vibe we bring to the weekend barbecue.

[00:03:57] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, and thinking about that, I remember a couple weeks ago, we had that story that, you know, gave everybody really hot heart cockles. And it's like, should we do like a special cheat sheet episode sometime with just all happy stories? What do you think? And what do your friends, the listeners think?

[00:04:16] [SPEAKER_03] I'm not trying to kill anyone's vibe here. I've seen like, I've listened to true crime podcasts where they're like, oh, this, we're going to do a happy, I don't want to hear that. Save it. If I wanted to be happy, I'd go outside and touch grass. I want to know about bad stuff happening. That's why I listen to true crime. That's my take.

[00:04:33] [SPEAKER_00] Well, let's see what the listener thinks. And also, it can be hard. What the one listener thinks. It can be very difficult to find like happy stories involving crime. And so also, if you think, yeah, you should cover the happy stories, maybe send us a couple so we don't have to look for them.

[00:04:49] [SPEAKER_03] I'm not trying to put anyone on blast here because I admire people who are optimistic and well-adjusted. Truly.

[00:04:56] [SPEAKER_00] Like you admire me.

[00:04:58] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah, says the guy doing a true crime podcast. I, like, love those people. You know, I feel like we need those people to have a society. Like, you know, if we're all morbid and maladjusted, that's a bad thing. But the thing is, like, when I, like, always just, like, sometimes you get comments of, like, oh, wow, that's really depressing. It's like, yeah, it's a murder. Like, what? Look at the name of the podcast. It's not going to be a happy story.

[00:05:21] [SPEAKER_00] So for you, you have no problem if you're about to go out, celebrate, like, a happy family event, like a wedding, and I call you aside and say, Anya, death, murder, destruction. Have a nice time, sweetie.

[00:05:36] [SPEAKER_03] Memento mori. Okay? Remember, you will die. And also, like, to me, I guess I compartmentalize it a lot now. And then sometimes I don't and it spills over. But I think for me, it's like we can, some of these stories at their best, we can memorialize the victims, talk about issues in society, and have serious adult conversations. So it's not about just reveling in what goes wrong and what's bad.

[00:06:01] [SPEAKER_03] It's about widening the conversation to be bigger than that. And I think that is important.

[00:06:08] [SPEAKER_00] Well, can't we revel in what goes right?

[00:06:11] [SPEAKER_02] What do you want to revel in right now?

[00:06:13] [SPEAKER_00] I'm sure there's, I just feel bad because people are about to have fun doing their little barbecues. They're, what do people do? Do people have barbecues? I think they do. I think they do. You go out. Apparently you're not invited to any of them. You go out, you watch the August fireworks. The August fireworks? You go to the old fish and traps. What do people do?

[00:06:40] [SPEAKER_02] Kevin's trying to connect with the common man and failing like some kind of out of touch politician.

[00:06:45] [SPEAKER_00] But before you do that, you know, we want to, hey, happy thoughts. We're not.

[00:06:50] [SPEAKER_03] So what are we going to become like a toxically positive show? These people were murdered. But at least this happened. Like what? I'm not saying every week. Maybe we should do a happy episode. Well, I'll let you. I don't. Maybe I'll let you find cases you find happy that warm the heart cockles, as you say. And I'll let you.

[00:07:09] [SPEAKER_00] You don't want to do that if people are like you and they're just sad and bitter. And that's all they want to think about. So if you want to see a happy episode, let us know.

[00:07:19] [SPEAKER_03] Why are you doing this? Because then people will say yes. And then inevitably I'll be like, well, it's your job now because you're the one who put this out there. And you're like, I can't believe I said this. Why do you let me say things on you? That's what's going to happen.

[00:07:31] [SPEAKER_00] Ultimately, all the content on the show is your responsibility. What's my responsibility? You're probably going to edit this episode. And if you wanted to, it could be, hey, Anya, I have an idea. Let's do things as normal.

[00:07:46] [SPEAKER_02] No, I like to teach you. There's consequences to your words.

[00:07:49] [SPEAKER_00] Have you done that in the past? Have you like crudely edited things to make me say whatever you want me to say?

[00:07:57] [SPEAKER_02] Edit out the heart cockles thing of this warms my heart. I am very normal. No, I've not done that.

[00:08:10] [SPEAKER_03] I'm not like doing the Stalin thing where he's editing that guy out of the picture. I like to just give people what this is. I'm not trying to make anyone look good or bad. I'm just putting it out as is.

[00:08:22] [SPEAKER_00] You're just living your life very lazy, fair. Whatever will be, will be. Right. The future, not ours to see. That's what she'd say. You always go around singing songs.

[00:08:34] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, that is true. It's like a musical in here. Are you quite finished?

[00:08:41] [SPEAKER_00] I just, I feel bad because you say, oh, yeah, you're going to have a happy weekend. But first, murder, suicide. And so I just, I'm just sharing.

[00:08:50] [SPEAKER_03] Maybe they're not having a happy weekend. Maybe they, you know, maybe they're just having a normal weekend.

[00:08:54] [SPEAKER_00] Well, maybe if you're having a bad weekend, maybe that's when you need to hear the happy stuff. So maybe people could have, oh, here's a happy episode of the murder sheet. Let's keep that in reserve. And then when something bad is happening to me, I'll have this to turn to.

[00:09:10] Okay.

[00:09:11] [SPEAKER_00] See, I'm always looking out for our dear friends to listen.

[00:09:13] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, you're doing a lot. You're doing, some might say too much.

[00:09:17] [SPEAKER_00] Well, you're welcome.

[00:09:20] [SPEAKER_03] My name is Anya Kane. I'm a journalist.

[00:09:23] [SPEAKER_00] And I'm Kevin Greenlee. I'm an attorney.

[00:09:26] [SPEAKER_03] And this is The Murder Sheet.

[00:09:27] [SPEAKER_00] We're a true crime podcast focused on original reporting, interviews, and deep dives into murder cases. We're The Murder Sheet.

[00:09:35] [SPEAKER_01] And this is The Cheat Sheet, Jingles and Justice.

[00:10:24] [SPEAKER_00] I look over at you, Anya. You're putting your suitcases away because we're right here in Indiana for the first case. There's no need to travel. You're just relaxing.

[00:10:32] [SPEAKER_03] That's exactly right, Kevin. So this first cold case, an unsolved case at that, occurred in Indiana in 1988, February 4th to be exact. This is a very sad case. And it's even sadder because we don't know who did this. And so I'm hoping that we're going to include a link in our show notes to the press release put out there by the Indiana State Police, which is still working on this.

[00:10:58] [SPEAKER_03] And we also have some reports from the wonderful newspapers.com, an excellent service if you're researching cold cases or even any older cases. For the Muncie, Indiana Star Press covered this, as did the Reporter Times of Martinsville. And the Indianapolis Star did some good coverage. And so these are all different publications that I'm basing this information off of.

[00:11:26] [SPEAKER_03] But we'll start with the state police's latest press release. They put out a press release about the murder of Evelyn Matchett. And she was 67 years old. She was a widow in 1988. Her husband, Elbert, or Dutch Matchett, had died in 1986. So she was living all by herself. She had a daughter. She was living all by herself on Pretty Lake in LaGrange County. She was 67 years old, as I mentioned.

[00:11:56] [SPEAKER_03] And she was murdered in her home on that February winter's day. Now, the Indiana State Police have investigated this, as has the LaGrange County Sheriff's Department. But despite those efforts, her killer has not yet been identified. The press release notes that, quote, hundreds of hours of investigative work have been poured into this case. Every lead has been chased. Every clue examined. But the answer remains hidden, end quote.

[00:12:21] [SPEAKER_03] So this is from the Indiana State Police cold case team, which is a project that Kevin and I very much support and is badly needed for the cold cases in this Hoosier state. What they're saying is they think someone out there knows something. They think someone out there has information about what happened to Evelyn, you know, and they want you to come forward. They note that this is a woman who deserved a lot better than what she got.

[00:12:47] [SPEAKER_03] And I'll go into more of the details of her heinous murder in a moment. But, you know, it doesn't have to be like someone doesn't have to like run up to me like I killed somebody. It might be just a weird statement that lingers with you for years. It might just be something you noticed that really didn't seem like a big deal at the time, but now does. And what I would tell people is, honestly, the people we're reaching, I think, you know, podcast listeners,

[00:13:14] [SPEAKER_03] you tend to be a bit younger or you're kind of adopting new technology more. Not everyone is in that boat. So the best thing you can do is that if you have family with connections to LaGrange County, if you have people who even just kind of drifted through that, that's those are the people you should be sparking up conversations with. Oh, was there ever any chatter about this? Did was there someone in town people suspected? You know, was there someone creepy in town at the time?

[00:13:41] [SPEAKER_03] Like, have those like that is the best thing you can do because you never know. Your grandma might be like, oh, yeah, there was that guy and didn't think it was important enough to go with. But you could be the catalyst for change in a case like this and get justice for Evelyn. So let's talk about what exactly happened to her. So she's found by emergency workers after her daughter, a woman in Fort Wayne, tried to call her and couldn't get a hold of her,

[00:14:09] [SPEAKER_03] drove to her house and couldn't get a hold of her. Emergency workers go in and they find her dead body. You know, the new press release says that she was murdered on the 4th. I know at the time what they said was they believed she was murdered on February 3rd at around 830 p.m. So I don't know if they've developed that or what happened.

[00:14:33] [SPEAKER_03] But yeah, this is a some of this information comes from LaGrange County Coroner Donald M. Stuckey. I know her autopsy was done in Battle Creek, Michigan. So they went out of town for that. But at first they were a bit tight lipped about any injury she might have sustained. But later on, they came out with that she was strangled.

[00:14:55] [SPEAKER_03] So obviously, like we can imagine, makes sense that they would have known she was murdered because that's not going to be something that happens really naturally. And she was strangled. She was all alone at home. It's really heartbreaking. And I hope that, I don't know, someone is able to come forward with information because, you know, you look at her picture, she just looks like a sweet old lady. You know, I mean, this shouldn't have happened to her.

[00:15:22] [SPEAKER_03] And the fear she must have felt being strangled is is really disturbing. So the information, if you have any information, again, this is one of those cold cases. It sounds like they've run down everything. And when you're when you've done everything and there's nothing more you can do, that's a cold case. So if you have something, however, minor. Contact the Indiana State Police. Go to ispcoldcase at isp.in.gov. That's their email. Email them your tip.

[00:15:54] [SPEAKER_03] Ispcoldcase at isp.in.gov. Or you can call them at 260-403-2841. We will also be including that information and a link in our show notes. But, yeah, spread the word with people who might have been from that general area of Indiana at the time. Talk about it. The best thing we can do for these cases sometimes is just keep talking about it because you never know who's going to be like, hmm, wait a minute. I had a boyfriend at that time who came back one winter's night and it was really odd.

[00:16:24] [SPEAKER_03] And this is the kind of case where that actually could help.

[00:16:28] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, and I wanted to mention we do have listeners all over the country, also all over the world. I wanted to say that if you're part of a law enforcement agency and there is a cold case that you want to get eyes on, please contact us and we will spotlight it on the show.

[00:16:48] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah. Literally, like, just send us something and we'll do it. Like, we'd love to talk to you. But if you just are like, nah, just here's a press release. I mean, we like to do these cold cases because they often are overlooked because, you know, they're not the big sexy case that everyone's freaking out about the trial or whatever. You know, and I get that from the public's perspective. But I think this is where true crime could actually do some societal good.

[00:17:12] [SPEAKER_00] Yes.

[00:17:13] [SPEAKER_03] So let's keep talking about Evelyn. If you any of you are from this area, from this pretty lake area, if you're from LaGrange County and you know something, but you don't know anything that's like investigative in nature, but you just knew her or you knew her family or someone wants to come forward. We'd love to have you on. We could spotlight the case even more. Email us at murdersheet at gmail dot com. This other case is an Indiana connected cold case that is actually warming up.

[00:17:41] [SPEAKER_03] So my I was recommended this one by a lovely listener. And one of my sources is the advocate. And then another one, she asked that I shout out a local independent journalist unfiltered with Kieran. Sorry if I'm saying that name wrong.

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[00:19:48] [SPEAKER_03] I've never been there, but I'm sure it's an interesting place. Actually, I have a weird personal connection to Louisiana, believe it or not. So when my grandmother came to this country, the United States, she emigrated from Ireland. Louisiana was where she went for very complicated and frankly disturbing reasons. Namely that she went to go be like a babysitter nanny for like these kids that were adopted from Ireland by a couple in Louisiana.

[00:20:18] [SPEAKER_03] So she got to experience, that was her first experience of America. But she eventually moved to New York. But so yeah, I've always kind of wanted to go there because there's that personal connection and she was there. I say disturbing because it's come out in years since that like basically the Catholic Church in Ireland was like taking kids from unwed mothers and like giving them away to, you know, like it was a bad, it was very bad, you know.

[00:20:43] [SPEAKER_03] And so there's some stuff that makes me wonder if those kids may have been in that boat, you know, based on what my grandma would tell me. But, you know, she wasn't taking them like she had nothing to do with it. She was just a young woman who got a job in America. But anyways, so Louisiana, this is Baton Rouge.

[00:21:06] [SPEAKER_03] And this is something that happened or at least was discovered on the morning of April 18th, 1987. So actually a little bit before Evelyn was murdered. And in this situation, you had, you know, this cleaning staff go into a hotel room at the Red Carpet Inn, which was on South Acadian Thruway in Baton Rouge, Louisiana.

[00:21:34] [SPEAKER_03] And they make a really horrifying discovery. I think it was like around like 930 in the morning when they when they came in. But I could be wrong on that. They find the body of a man, Thomas L. Klotz, and it was very clear that he had been murdered. Now, let's back up a little bit and talk about who Mr. Klotz was, because he actually kind of had an interesting job. He was from Fort Wayne, Indiana.

[00:21:57] [SPEAKER_03] The only real record I could find on him in, you know, linking him to that is that he seemingly was divorced a couple of years earlier in Allen County courts. And you also. Yeah. So like he he had that connection to that area, but it sounds like he did a lot of traveling for work because he would go around and basically write jingles for radio stations. So he was in Baton Rouge to do that for WJBO.

[00:22:26] [SPEAKER_00] And people do we know what a jingle is?

[00:22:29] [SPEAKER_03] And WFMF. What? Why wouldn't people know what a jingle is?

[00:22:33] [SPEAKER_00] It was like a little advertising song.

[00:22:35] [SPEAKER_03] Yes. I think people know what jingles are.

[00:22:38] [SPEAKER_00] Like you deserve a break today or something like that.

[00:22:41] [SPEAKER_03] Why don't you sing a murder sheet jingle, Kevin?

[00:22:43] [SPEAKER_00] Well, I'll tell you what. Why don't our dear friends, the listeners, send in some murder sheet jingles?

[00:22:49] [SPEAKER_03] Well, you know, that was I mean, I was thinking that there's certain jingles that like linger in my head. Like, I don't know if anyone else is from the New York area. But like here's something. Salino and Barnes, injury attorneys. Does anyone remember that? That was we were obsessed with Salino and Barnes and my family. We made up all this lore about them. It was great. But yeah, a jingle can really burrow its way into your mind. And that's the job because you're supposed to make it like memorable and make people, you know, go back to whatever that it was.

[00:23:18] [SPEAKER_00] And no one's surprised that you're fascinated with jingles celebrating attorneys. That seems very much an Anya thing to do.

[00:23:30] [SPEAKER_02] That was that was how you got me with your jingle. You lured me in.

[00:23:35] [SPEAKER_00] I'm a man of many gifts and talents.

[00:23:39] [SPEAKER_02] Kevin's love jingle. The haunting Kevin love theme. No, I wasn't obsessed with them in that way. We just thought the commercials were funny and they always looked really like kind of tense. And so we would have like, oh, are they feuding or whatever?

[00:23:55] [SPEAKER_03] I think unfortunately one of them died tragically in an airplane crash. So that sucks. But yeah, that was like a that was a famous jingle in the New York area.

[00:24:03] [SPEAKER_00] But we digress.

[00:24:04] [SPEAKER_03] We digress. So he was in town to do those jingles for those radio stations, checked into the hotel or motel at April 10th. And I think he was actually supposed to leave pretty soon, which is tragic because he ultimately was not able to leave ever. You know, but that was according to his brother in law, apparently, that he was heading out. So he was found dead of multiple stab wounds.

[00:24:29] [SPEAKER_03] He was apparently suffering from six stab wounds in his throat, seven stab wounds in his chest, which one was fatal and blunt force trauma to his left eye. His hands, his arms were tied behind his back with a nylon cord. And, you know, it's just a horrible crime scene, like very, very brutal. Police run down a couple of leads. They look they're looking into his rental car in 1987 Mercury Cougar.

[00:24:58] [SPEAKER_03] And that was missing from the motel. And then it was later found, I believe, at the University Club Apartments on Alaska Street. And they were looking into the rope that was used to bind him. They said that that did not come from the hotel. And they said that different items that he had were missing from the motel.

[00:25:22] [SPEAKER_03] So they were looking at actually a robbery gone wrong or just a horrible, horrifying robbery. But they kept the cord and they all, you know, they, you know, other pieces of evidence. Apparently in 2011, they submitted those for DNA analysis with the Louisiana State Police Lab. And it came back negative at the time for a suspect profile.

[00:25:48] [SPEAKER_03] And then they, I think they, they submitted it to the, yeah. So then they tried it again in 2019. They retested the cord and they developed a profile for Sean Atkinson. And they, oh, DNA warrant was issued. But here's where it's really, this guy's in Mobile, Alabama. Bizarrely, nothing happened at that point because apparently the detective working the case for the cold case unit was transferred.

[00:26:17] [SPEAKER_03] And the case went dormant again. I don't understand that. I have a lot of questions about how does that happen? Do you have any thoughts?

[00:26:28] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, I have questions too. It seems, it seems unusual.

[00:26:31] [SPEAKER_03] Seems concerning. Listen, I mean, one reason I praised Indiana State Police for putting together the cold case unit is because in the hit, I think they actually focus on these cold cases and that that's what these deserve. But we've heard so many horror stories of like police agencies putting together a cold case team and then not having it anymore and then putting it together. And it's all like dependent on funding and blah, blah, blah. It can be very political. It's very upsetting to me when that happens. It's like these cold cases are important.

[00:27:01] [SPEAKER_03] Somebody died horribly. Someone deserves to at least get answers about what happened, if not have someone be punished for it. And, you know, messing around with this stuff, it bothers me. I don't know how this happened. I don't know if that's a sign that this case is, you know, going to have some problems with it. I don't know. But it confuses me. Anyways, recently police reopened the case. Again, it sounds like they had the frigging case solved. So what happened in 2019?

[00:27:26] [SPEAKER_03] They obtained another warrant and they matched Atkinson with the National DNA Database. And he was arrested in Mobile and has been booked into the East Baton Rouge Paris prison for second degree murder. So some other interesting tidbits I was able to find about this guy.

[00:27:44] [SPEAKER_03] The Huntsville Times in 1990, accessed through newspapers.com, reported that he had been charged at the age of 26 in a burglary in that that apparently caused an apartment fire that killed a man named Danny Ray Walker. No idea what happened with that case. But obviously that's another tragedy that happened. But he that you know, that certainly indicates some kind of history, criminal history.

[00:28:13] [SPEAKER_03] The Baldwin Press Register of Mobile, Alabama also reported that when he was 42, he was charged with public intoxication. And some more information about Thomas L. Klotz. If this is the same guy, the Louisville Times reported that in 1976, he reported that two men robbed him of $37 at 8.45 p.m. on First Street and Woodlawn Avenue.

[00:28:39] [SPEAKER_03] And he's also listed in the Boston Globe as being, you know, at the local sales manager for W.E.Z.E. Radio and that he previously was with W.W.E.L. AM FM. So very sad what happened to him, a very brutal and horrifying death. I hope that they're able to kind of find the true answer of this at this point. And I hope that the issues in 2019 do not come back to haunt them.

[00:29:06] [SPEAKER_03] And if anyone knows why that happened or why that could happen, please let me know because it. It's disturbing. But I hope that. Now is finally the conclusion that this case needs.

[00:29:19] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, I agree completely.

[00:29:22] [SPEAKER_03] I think we're time time for some Kevin cases. I picked two cold cases and you picked two murder suicides. So we are a bundle of laughs today on the murder sheet.

[00:29:31] [SPEAKER_00] That's what I was trying to say at the top of the episode. We need we need happy stuff.

[00:29:37] [SPEAKER_02] Do we?

[00:29:39] [SPEAKER_00] Well, you know, Anya, I know you may not be familiar with it, but happiness is a good thing.

[00:29:47] [SPEAKER_03] I thought you were going to start singing happiness is a warm gun.

[00:29:51] [SPEAKER_00] You just can't get away from the violence.

[00:29:54] [SPEAKER_02] No. Can't escape.

[00:29:57] [SPEAKER_00] I want to talk about this case out of Texas. My sources are K-H-O-U for two articles. And then I also consulted a complaint that was filed in court.

[00:30:12] [SPEAKER_00] And this is actually a case that starts all the way back in the first week in May, where a restaurant operator in Houston named Matthew Mitchell and his wife, T. Mitchell, are killed in a murder suicide by Mr. Mitchell. And I should say here the outside.

[00:30:40] [SPEAKER_00] I called his wife, T. Mitchell. Her parents have asked that she be referred to by her maiden name. Again, I apologize if I mispronounce it, but I believe it's T. My. So I will not be referring to her as Miss Mitchell.

[00:30:57] [SPEAKER_03] You always want to respect, you know, the family's wishes in an instance like this. And I will note, I actually briefly covered this cheat sheet. I don't know if you remember, but you're going into it in a heck of a lot more depth than I did. So this is a follow up to what that was.

[00:31:11] [SPEAKER_00] So we covered this when it happened.

[00:31:14] [SPEAKER_03] I think a little while ago. But you did a lot more digging because I think there was a lot more to be done there. Yes.

[00:31:21] [SPEAKER_00] So Mr. Mitchell, in this incident, he shot his four-year-old son, his eight-year-old daughter, and then his wife, Ty, before taking his own life. And he was well known in the Houston scene for his restaurants. And she also was well known and beloved.

[00:31:47] [SPEAKER_00] And it is just a horrible tragedy that unfolded in the first week of May down in the great state of Texas. So now you're saying, well, why are we talking about it now in August? And the reason is Ty's parents have filed a wrongful death lawsuit about this. And they say basically, they say a couple of things.

[00:32:17] [SPEAKER_00] One thing is that Mr. Mitchell had some financial problems and he was worried about being humiliated if news of his financial problems got out to the public.

[00:32:32] [SPEAKER_00] And so they allege that he did some shady things near the end of his life where with the assistance of some family members, some of his assets were moved over to hide them in family members' accounts, things of that nature. And then after he's dead, they're moved back to his account. And I should mention, that's worth mentioning, it is something that's brought up in this lawsuit.

[00:33:00] [SPEAKER_00] But there is, at least at the moment, no fraud investigation. There's no investigation into those things. And basically, all it is now is an allegation in a civil wrongful death lawsuit that, at least as far as I know, Mr. Mitchell's surviving relatives have not yet responded to.

[00:33:23] [SPEAKER_02] Okay.

[00:33:25] [SPEAKER_00] But there's some other details. Again, I say they say that this murder-suicide is prompted by his ongoing financial problems and his desire to escape the humiliation of those being revealed. And then this, he plotted this murder-suicide for a while.

[00:33:49] [SPEAKER_00] And it turns out that some of his talking about it is captured in ring camera audio and videos that were recorded over the course of a little bit more than a week. And I'm going to read some of these things that he said that was captured by this audio.

[00:34:19] [SPEAKER_00] Most of this stuff is him talking. There are a couple of times when it's other people talking to him. So I'm going to read some of these. It's certainly upsetting, and I caution people of that. On April 24th at 1.11 p.m., he says, You can't make a decision. You're too far gone. I love you all. 1.25 p.m., we can't stop it. Losing our money.

[00:34:48] [SPEAKER_00] Is there even a remote hope? Not even if I was strong enough. 2.05, what am I doing? Am I just going to try to lie to her? 2.15, ending my life now. 1.109 a.m. on April 27th. I did this. What are we doing? What are we doing? What are we doing? 11.16 a.m. I had such a great life. 11.28 a.m. You're done. You're done. You're all done.

[00:35:18] [SPEAKER_00] 12.26 p.m. I just want out of this. I want out of this. Please, please, please. 12.31 p.m. Complete despair. Complete despair. Spare everybody's. 12.49 p.m. I wanted to spare her pain. Spare my kids the pain. There's no way to figure this out. There's no way to figure this out. They're going to say, you, we want all our money. 12.53 p.m. I just need to do it. I could have done it last night.

[00:35:48] [SPEAKER_00] Now I have to wait all over again. All over again. Another problem. 12.56 p.m. You're going to get sued into oblivion. Everyone is going to sue you. Jesus Christ. This is going to be so bad. 1.23 p.m. And then what? Or I just stay in this torture chamber every day. 3.52 p.m. What's happening to me? What's happened? 3.53 p.m. You've got to end it. You've got to end it. You can't fix any of this.

[00:36:17] [SPEAKER_00] You're not strong enough. You're not strong enough. You're already this up. I shouldn't have done this. I shouldn't have done this. I shouldn't have done this. How did this happen? 4.10 p.m. There's no hope. There's no hope. This is the worst day of my life. 4.21 p.m. Jesus Christ. What have I done? I shouldn't have been in charge. It was me that put myself in charge. I need to just. It's over. It's over.

[00:36:47] [SPEAKER_00] I now know. 4.47 p.m. I got to kill everybody. And it. Oh. 10.43 a.m. On April 30th. Don't do this. Don't do this. Don't do this. I don't see any way out. I made so many bad mistakes here. So many bad mistakes. 12.14 p.m. Am I going to do it or not? Good Lord. So. A man with. Under significant stress. With significant problems.

[00:37:16] [SPEAKER_00] And. Just wallowing. In it. And it's really horrifying. To read that. How self. Involved. He is.

[00:37:28] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah. I mean like just no feeling for like. Your family wants to be alive. Like if you go into financial. Disrepair. They're alive. Like the priorities.

[00:37:41] [SPEAKER_00] It's all about him.

[00:37:42] [SPEAKER_03] It's all about how he looks to the public. It's all about how he appears to other people. Because that's the most important thing in the world.

[00:37:50] [SPEAKER_00] And. Certainly problems in this world can be serious. But as long as you are alive. And those you love are alive. There's always hope to get through them. And come out on the other side.

[00:38:04] [SPEAKER_03] But then you don't get to act like a winner all the time. You know. Like you don't get to act like I'm just the biggest. Fancy restaurant man in the world.

[00:38:12] [SPEAKER_00] And I would just encourage. If there's anybody listening to this. Who's having problems. Please talk to somebody. And no. It doesn't have to end this way.

[00:38:22] [SPEAKER_03] I'm just going to say this. Like I am the biggest. I have a real issue with being a perfectionist. And it would suck. Yeah. If our business were to collapse. And we were to go. Have to you know. Like go into bankruptcy. Or whatever. I mean I'm not. I'm not underplaying how much that would totally suck. To go through. But. Yeah. Get help. If you're having like suicidal or homicidal thoughts over it. You need to get help. Because that's not. It's not the end of the world.

[00:38:51] [SPEAKER_03] It truly isn't. You know what is the end of the world? Murdering your family and yourself. You know. Killing yourself. Murdering your family. Like that. You can't come back from. You can come back from financial mistakes. You can come back from. Job loss. You can come back from. We have to. Have a less. We have to spend less. Or we have. I can't live at this kind of lifestyle. Or we have to move to someplace cheaper. You can survive all that. Can even come back stronger from it. But. You can't survive death.

[00:39:21] [SPEAKER_03] And. Not giving your family like even the option of that. Your little children. Is horrible.

[00:39:28] [SPEAKER_00] And making this decision for them. And acting like you're doing them a favor. Because you're like sparing them something worse.

[00:39:34] [SPEAKER_03] Sparing them what? Being poor? A lot of people are like struggling financially. And they have happy. And you know. They could. You could be happy and have an okay life. If you have to those struggles. You know. I don't know.

[00:39:47] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah. And. The voices of his kids. Are. On here. It's.

[00:39:52] [SPEAKER_03] You wish the wife could have heard this. You know. I mean. It's like. It's so tragic. She probably just thought. Everything was fine. Like my heart breaks for her and those babies. And can't imagine like someone you love is plotting this against you. And. You don't even know it.

[00:40:11] [SPEAKER_00] On May 3rd. And. He says to his wife. Love you. His wife says to their daughter. Who's showing them something she did. Oh. That's really nice. Why I'm really impressed with you. And then she says to her husband. The teacher said she did really good on her test today. So. This is just a woman who. Loved her kids. And was proud of her kids. And deserved. Quite a lot. More than this. Obviously.

[00:40:40] [SPEAKER_00] And I have so much feeling. And compassion. For her parents. And if there is any. Dirty dealing here. Where. Some of Mr. Mitchell's relatives. Were helping him try to do stuff financially. That was inappropriate. I hope they get as much justice. As possible. Because I can't. I can't even begin to fathom. What it must be like to go through a loss like this.

[00:41:06] [SPEAKER_03] It really is horrible. But thank you so much. For doing a deeper dive into that case.

[00:41:11] [SPEAKER_00] Yes. So then I wanted to also talk. About a. Not entirely dissimilar case. In Michigan. And I say.

[00:41:22] [SPEAKER_02] Oh yeah.

[00:41:23] [SPEAKER_00] It's not dissimilar. Only. I'm not suggesting there's financial. Dirty dealing here. Because I think it's too early to know. The details. Tales. Uh. A man. Named. Christopher. Carol. Keywicks. Uh. His. And his wife. Amanda. And their six. Children. Are. Found. Dead. In their home. In Grand Haven. Township. In Michigan. After a fire. And it has been ruled. A murder.

[00:41:53] [SPEAKER_00] Suicide. I should say. My sources for this. Are. WoodTV.com. And Cleveland.com. Uh. Investigators say. That he shot his wife. And their kids. And then set the house on fire. And killed himself. And the family's pets. Also were killed. In this. Incident. So again. This is a. A horrible. Tragedy. And sometimes.

[00:42:22] [SPEAKER_00] You try to look for reasons. Like oh. Was there financial. Or what have you. And. The fact is. Sometimes. It feels to me like. The search for reasons. Is futile. Because there's. There's no reason. To explain. The unexplainable. There. There's no. No piece. Of information. That I can give you. That you can then say. Oh. This makes sense now. Because it. It never. Will make sense. It is just. Horrifying.

[00:42:51] [SPEAKER_03] Well. I don't know about that. To me. The piece of information. That makes sense. Is you have controlling. Narcissistic parents. Who decide that. Their families. Are extensions. Of themselves. And there should go. Therefore should go down. With the. The proverbial ship. You know. It has to do with. Personality. And the kind of person. Who's doing this. More so than any. How many people. Do you think. Go bankrupt a day. How many people. Do you think. Get divorced any day. How many people. Like no one. But.

[00:43:20] [SPEAKER_03] The type of person. Who does this. It's like about them. Not about the circumstances. They're in.

[00:43:27] [SPEAKER_00] I'm just saying. There's no problem. That these people. Can have. That is big enough. To explain. This action.

[00:43:33] [SPEAKER_01] Well said.

[00:43:34] [SPEAKER_00] What. What interested. Me. About this. Is there. Was. A reddit. Account. That. Local. Journalists. Say. We've been able. To. To confirm. That this. Account. Actually. Belong. To. Amanda. Amanda. And I think. They did that. By looking. You know. When people. Are posting. A lot. On reddit. They're. Allowing. Little bits. And details. About their. Lives. To spill through. And people. Were able. To look at that. And say.

[00:44:04] [SPEAKER_00] Everything here. Bits. Amanda. I don't think. There's been. An official. Confirmation. That this. Account. Was hers. But again. Reporters. Feel. Pretty confident. That. It was. And. What's. Interesting. Is. These. Posts. Talk. About. Things. Such. As. Her. Discovering. That her. Husband. Had. Cheated. On. Issues. With. Marriage.

[00:44:34] [SPEAKER_00] Counseling. And. Therapy. Economic. Issues. And. Things. Of. That. Nature. And. One. Thing. About. This. Jumped. Out. At. Me. Is. That. A. Spokesman. For. The. Emily. Jones. Said. I'll. Just. Quote. From. The. This. This. I'm. Quoting. Miss.

[00:45:04] [SPEAKER_00] Jones. I do. Want. To. It. Clear. We. Have. No. Way. To. Confirm. That. That. Mandy. That. The. It's. Very. Clear. That. Whoever. Wrote. That. They. Were. Using. Reddit. Uh. I think. It's. That's sad. In and of itself. Whether it was Mandy. Or somebody else. It's sad. If someone feels like they can't speak their fears out loud outside of something like Reddit.

[00:45:32] [SPEAKER_00] And that just made me think because I think in this day and age for a lot of us much of our social life is online. And communities like Reddit at their best do give people an outlet to talk about things that can be hard to talk about and seek comfort from a community that understands them.

[00:46:01] [SPEAKER_00] And certainly online we've been able to meet a lot of people we wouldn't otherwise have met including all of you listeners. And I certainly take great pleasure and pride in the community our listeners have built around the show. And so I'm not sure I see it as sad.

[00:46:23] [SPEAKER_00] I feel glad that she had an outlet of any kind where she could share her story and get comfort and reach out to people who understood her. And I also take some comfort in the fact that her story in her own words is now out there because she found a way to express it. What do you think?

[00:46:48] [SPEAKER_03] I agree with you. I think it's sad in the sense that she wasn't able to get away from this creep, you know, and get her kids away from them. I mean, that's tragic. But as far as her talking about what's going on, we should be encouraging people to do that. You know, we should be encouraging people who are suffering in a relationship to get safe, get help, get out, you know. And it's very hard to do that.

[00:47:18] [SPEAKER_03] But the more we can talk about it, the more it might actually inspire people to do it.

[00:47:21] [SPEAKER_00] And there are things that are difficult to talk about, which are like infidelity, job problems, things like that. And if it's hard to talk about that with people you know offline, talk about it online. Try to find some support there.

[00:47:38] [SPEAKER_03] It really breaks my mind. I mean, all those kids and doing it and like setting the place on fire. It's just it's horrible.

[00:47:45] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, terrible stuff. Terrible stuff.

[00:47:48] [SPEAKER_03] Yeah.

[00:47:49] [SPEAKER_00] These these women and their children deserve so much more.

[00:47:53] [SPEAKER_03] They do. They do. You know, and I just think the family annihilation stuff is is something that really horrifies me that you can't see your children or your spouse. Women can perpetrate this. Oftentimes we oftentimes it's men. But I think it's fair to say that women can be family annihilators, too. And but just like not being able to see your kids is like anything more than a problem to solve or anything more than an extension of yourself where it's like, well, if I go, so do they.

[00:48:21] [SPEAKER_03] I can't even like that's that's not that's not love. You know, like that's I don't know what that is. It's just control. You know, you loved your kids. You would want them to be alive, even if you make a choice not to be. I just don't get it. It's just very there's some things where I'm like, oh, I can kind of understand like growing up in poverty and joining a gang, you know, but like something like this. It's like, what are you doing? I don't know. I leave it to the psychologist.

[00:48:51] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, it's it's unexplainable. Yeah, this is what I was saying. This is the kind of story we leave people with. It's it is tragic, but I do take some comfort that there are these online communities and they've certainly been a blessing to us.

[00:49:04] [SPEAKER_03] Well, I hope that people can take from it that this stuff can happen even if you seemingly have a picture perfect life. You know, you could seem to have a family that has all the trappings of success, a beautiful family, whatever. And you never know what's going on behind closed doors. And it's important to maybe see the signs. And look at the subtle cues that a relationship may have a power and control dynamic or that there may be danger ahead.

[00:49:32] [SPEAKER_03] In order to protect yourself and people you love. But anyway, thank you all so much for listening and have a have a good weekend.

[00:49:40] [SPEAKER_00] Before that, I feel we should mention we do have great premium, great premium content.

[00:49:49] [SPEAKER_02] What are you laughing about?

[00:49:51] [SPEAKER_00] Well, it's awkward to suddenly go into plugging yourself after that.

[00:49:55] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, I know.

[00:49:55] [SPEAKER_00] I'm sorry. But we do try to have we enjoy our community. You guys make it possible. We offer extra shows, ad free shows, early shows both on Patreon and Apple.

[00:50:08] [SPEAKER_03] Yes, it is a really fun community. I do really enjoy. Enjoy our true murder sheet people. They're very fun. And and by subscribing, you definitely make the show possible. And we're eternally grateful to all of you who do subscribe. And if it's something you might enjoy, check it out. I think there's like trial memberships. You can see if it's for you and and we really appreciate it.

[00:50:30] Yeah.

[00:50:31] [SPEAKER_03] Right. Thank you guys and have a good weekend.

[00:50:34] [SPEAKER_00] Thanks so much for listening to the murder sheet. If you have a tip concerning one of the cases we cover, please email us at murdersheet at gmail.com. If you have actionable information about an unsolved crime, please report it to the appropriate authorities.

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[00:51:17] [SPEAKER_00] Special thanks to Kevin Tyler Greenlee, who composed the music for The Murder Sheet, and who you can find on the web at kevintg.com.

[00:51:27] [SPEAKER_03] If you're looking to talk with other listeners about a case we've covered, you can join the Murder Sheet discussion group on Facebook. We mostly focus our time on research and reporting, so we're not on social media much. We do try to check our email account, but we ask for patience as we often receive a lot of messages. Thanks again for listening.